




From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 16:35
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Religion and Origami

Xandra Leong wrote:
> hmm I though I was in a origami mailing list.. when has this became a
> religion mailing list??
I guess that happened when people started quoting other people's
messages in full just to question their appropriateness ;-).

Matthias





From: Bob Stack <Noobob@AOL.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 16:37
Subject: Re: [NO] Hermit for 9 years

Martha Winslow-Cole a geezer?  Not the one I know!!!!! Very young and
vital!!!!!!!
                                                                    Bob Stack





From: "Askinazi, Brett" <brett@HAGERHINGE.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 16:45
Subject: Re: Fish base

Diagrams for the fish base can be found here :

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Academy/4800/d_fishbase.gif

Have fun.

Brett

-----Original Message-----
From: Anine Cleve [mailto:anine20@USA.NET]
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 1:49 PM
To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Fish base

Hi!

Where can I find diagrams for the fish base on the net?
I'll be waiting :)
Thanks in advance!
                       Anine

____________________________________________________________________
Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1





From: Martha Winslow-Cole <afolder@AVANA.NET>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 16:55
Subject: Re: [NO] Hermit for 9 years

Bob Stack wrote:

> Martha Winslow-Cole a geezer?  Not the one I know!!!!! Very young and
> vital!!!!!!!
>                                                                     Bob Stack

Don't I wish, but many thanks for the compliment anyway.

Martha





From: "Jerry D. Harris" <LOKICORP@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 16:59
Subject: Re: Religion and Origami

Message text written by Origami List
>nd thus censorship rears its ugly head. Funny how "non-religious" types
always accuse the "religious" types of being narrow-minded.

Think about it: origami has long been associated with religion in Japan.
The
word "kami" itself is a pun, meaning both "paper" and "spirit/god"
(different characters, though). What about the numerous models of mythical
creatures? What about the representations of zodiac characters (both
eastern
and western)? What about the various books of "religious" origami already
in
print (e.g. the "Jewish Origami" by our very own Florence Temko)?
<

        I'm all for free speech, even though proselytizing is one of the
very few things that ticks me off almost to the point of violence.  Origami
is public domain, and anyone and everyone has the right to do with it what
they please.  If the rest of us don't like it, free speech also gives us
the right to tell the other what they can do with it...

 _,_
 ____/_\,) .. _
--____-===( _\/ \\/ \-----_---__
 /\ ' ^__/>/\____\--------
__________/__\_ ____________________________.//__.//_________

 Jerry D. Harris
 Fossil Preparation Lab
 New Mexico Museum of Natural History
 1801 Mountain Rd NW
 Albuquerque NM 87104-1375
 Phone: (505) 899-2809
 Fax: (505) 841-2866
 102354.2222@compuserve.com





From: Elaina Quackenbush <elaina_quackenbush@NETZERO.NET>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 17:01
Subject: Re: Religion and Origami

Whether or not religion is involved, I have found that good diagrams come from
     the religious
people that try and get you there.

I myself teach yearly to a children's class the crane for the 1000 cranes for
     peace, that are
used in the classes, then donated to nursing homes and children's hospitals.

If this, as several churches in my area do this (all religions) is putting
     origami together with
religion, then I don't think it may be such a bad thing.

Even a Buddhist temple in Dallas teaches an origami class...starting with the
     traditional
offering folds.

Elaina

Download the Lycos Browser at http://lycos.neoplanet.com

__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 17:04
Subject: [NO] Re: Religion and Origami

At 16:57 99/11/18 -0500, Jerry Harris wrote:
>        I'm all for free speech, even though proselytizing is one of the
>very few things that ticks me off almost to the point of violence.  Origami
>is public domain, and anyone and everyone has the right to do with it what
>they please.  If the rest of us don't like it, free speech also gives us
>the right to tell the other what they can do with it...

So...were you agreeing with me, disagreeing with me, or simply using my
message as a jumping off point for your own take on the whole thing?

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 17:37
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree

ohh but I really wish it is orgami ah.. do u guys see any pretty ones online
like?
Xandra

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mary Stansbury" <MSTANSBU@SLIS.KENT.EDU>
To: <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 1:18 PM
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree

I believe I've seen a Christmas tree in either Kenneth Ody's _Paper
folding and paper sculpture_ or Hiroshi Ogawa's _Forms of paper_.
The one I've seen is not origami, but you cut paper so that a tree
"unfolds" (kind of like a spiral cut ham).  You can make the tree any
size you want.

Mary Stansbury, PhD
Assistant Professor
Kent State U. - SLIS
Phone:  330-672-2782





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 17:37
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Religion and Origami

okay I am apart of the origami religion.. hehe now I think I got many
followers.. :P
Xandra

----- Original Message -----
From: "Matthias Gutfeldt" <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
To: <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 1:32 PM
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Religion and Origami

Xandra Leong wrote:
> hmm I though I was in a origami mailing list.. when has this became a
> religion mailing list??
I guess that happened when people started quoting other people's
messages in full just to question their appropriateness ;-).

Matthias





From: Dave Stephenson <EruditusD@AOL.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 17:39
Subject: Re: Buckyballs,

Im trying again now...

Have fun.

Dave-S





From: Nick Robinson <nick@CHEESYPEAS.DEMON.CO.UK>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 17:58
Subject: Re: British Origami Magazine Issue 200

Rick Beech <Ricknbeech@AOL.COM> sez

>a collection of the 10 most popular folds, as nominated by our members.

I presume voting will be in the forthcoming issue? I'd better get
thinking now. Yoshizawa's pigeon, the flapper, Neale's dragon &
Megrath's pipe, Kasahara's Fox (with curly ears) & a Shen dish will
definately be in mine.

Any joy with those mains units?

all the best,

Nick Robinson

email           nick@purplepeople.co.uk
homepage        http://www.cheesypeas.demon.co.uk
BOS homepage    http://www.rpmrecords.co.uk/bos/





From: Dave Stephenson <EruditusD@AOL.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 20:29
Subject: Re: Buckyballs,

Ha, worked this time.

Dave.... but why did it send 2 copies??





From: DORIGAMI@AOL.COM
Date: 18 Nov 1999 22:26
Subject: Re: Buckyballs question from Dorigami

Will someone please explain Buckyballs to me.  What and where are they
anyway?  Dorigami





From: Rachel Katz <mandrk@MAIL.PB.NET>
Date: 18 Nov 1999 23:43
Subject: Thinkquest Awards

HI all,

If you'd like to cheer on the "Travel to Oriland team, " you can call greetings
to their temporary (Thursday Nov. 18 - Tuesday Nov.22) address at the Universal
Hilton City and Towers in Los Angeles. (818) 506-2500. They may be registered
under Shumakov or Choumakov. The final awards presentation will be held on
Monday and can be viewed  "real time" at 4:30 Pacific Standard Time.

 http://www.thinkquest.org/awards_wknd/event.shtml

Anyone in the area might be able to see them and support them in person.

Rachel Katz
Origami - it's not just for squares!





From: Mark Morden <marmonk@ESKIMO.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 01:04
Subject: Re: Religion and Origami

> Please understand I am not anti-religious.  Its just that I wonder how
others
> feel about this use of origami to advertice and promote religion or entice
> new members.

Origami is a means of expression and communication.  If one wants to express
thier religious beliefs in origami, so be it.  If someone wants to fold a
cross or dove or yin/yang symbol to use as a way to engage dialogue about
what those symbols mean, then origami is a tool to communication.  If you
don't take to those type of models, then turn the page or walk away.

What if someone, years and years ago, looked at the Renaissance art and said
"Do we want paintings and sculptures to advertise and promote religion?"
Poor Michealangelo would have been out of work and our culture would have
been poorer for it.

>Do we want the art of origami to become associated with religous
> recruitment?  Do we want the "Folding of 1000 Cranes" to become a
religious
> symbol?

Do you want this list to become the "Origami Cultural Police"?    What does
it matter what WE want?  Origami is bigger than this list.  People will fold
what they want.  Creators will develop models that express their ideas,
beliefs, and personality.   If your logic is extended, there will be a group
that doesn't like dinosaurs and will complain that origami is being too
closely associated with paleontology.  Another group will complain that all
the origami insect models are being used to recruit entomologists.  Will we
want origami being associated with recruitment to the sciences?? ;-)  As
said before, if you don't like the model, go on to the next one. If you
don't like how a group is using origami, then express your concerns to THEM.

Mark Morden
marmonk@eskimo.com





From: Julia Palffy <jupalffy@BLUEWIN.CH>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 02:51
Subject: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

Hello,
Kenneth (or was it Kelly?) wrote:
"Actually, tho I might be wrong about this, I think they started out
as animal sacrifices, and cheap ones at that, and are still used
as such in some religions.

With Jesus being a (symbolic?) sacrifice in the Christian religion,
the Dove then becomes a symbol for Jesus."

Please allow me to put a few things straight.
Actually, in the Christian religion (and before that in the Jewish
religion? please correct me if I'm mistaken), the dove symbolises peace
because, according to the Bible, it was the first bird sent out from Noah's
Ark that brought back something (a twig of olive), as a sign that the
waters of the Flood were subsiding, and that life on earth would be
possible again. This is the origin of the dove's symbolical meaning.
In the New Testament, the evangelist John writes that he saw the Holy
Spirit descend upon Jesus in the shape of a dove, which was for him (John),
the sign that Jesus was really sent by God. Thus the dove became the symbol
for the Holy Spirit in Christianity. BTW, the sacrifical animal with which
Jesus is connected is not the dove, but the lamb.

Any confusion between the dove and the crane as symbols of peace will be
due to their common symbolism and modern syncretism.

As to Christianity being a martial religion - that certainly wasn't the
original message, even though enough has been done to deserve that
definition!

The Swastika of Nazi Germany does not come from the Roman cross (if
anything, the cross with equal branches is called a Greek cross, and the
cross (in many variations) already was a symbol in other religions long
before Christianity existed, cf. the Ankh), but is (interestingly) the
mirror image of the Hindu Swastika which was a symbol of peace and good
wishes. The reversing of the symbol may have meant also a reversal of its
meaning!

Instead of making global judgements about any religion, I'd like to say
that all of them have somewhere in their Holy Books the Golden Rule - Treat
others as you want to be treated. Moses, Buddha, Jesus and Mohammed (if
there are others you'd like mentioned, you are welcome to complete the
list) were originally concerned about finding ways for people to live
realistically and peacefully together. So why don't we use our energy to
put into practice what they understood about that, instead of wasting it
hitting each other on the head to prove that one was better than the other?

To move on to something else Kenneth wrote about, writing as originally
invented in the "western" part of the world (as in relation to the Far East
and without considering the Far West for the moment being, otherwise it
gets too complicated!) - well, to be short in Sumer & Babylon & Egypt,
seems to have been used first for commercial purposes, then for religious
and legal purposes, but people did not yet have enough self-awareness to
write literature as we understand it. (to anyone who is interested in
knowing more about this, I recommend reading "The Gifts of the Jews" by
Thomas Cahill).

As to women writers, although nowadays the European Middle Ages get
described as obscurantist and anti-feministic, there were quite a lot of
women in the 12th and 13th century who left lasting literary works - the
Lays of Marie de France and the City of Ladies of Christine de Pisan in
France, the works of Hildegard von Bingen in Germany and Julian of Norwich
in England (probably there are more, but these are the names I can remember
right now). And they were probably freer to express themselves than English
women in the 19th century, when George Eliot and the Bronte sisters had to
use male pseudonyms to get published, because writing wasn't considered an
activity suitable for women! However, because of this freedom, medieval
European women did not actually have to develop a different script like
their Japanese sisters...

Kenneth, I find your contributions most stimulating! :)

Now I guess I'll get off the soapbox and back to folding... :o)

Julia ("Should've been a schoolmarm !") Palffy
Zug, Switzerland
jupalffy@bluewin.ch

__________
I__I__I__I__I
I__I__I__I__I
I__I__I__I__I
I__I__I__I__I   There are more possibilities than you imagine.





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 03:01
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Religion and Origami

>===== Original Message From Origami List <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU> =====
>okay I am apart of the origami religion.. hehe now I think I got many
>followers.. :P
>Xandra

Master Xandra: Do we get to wear cool paper pyramids, like in "Bowfinger" ?
Who created those pyramids? They looked a lot like Maarten van Gelder's
pyramid.

Matthias





From: DLister891@AOL.COM
Date: 19 Nov 1999 04:55
Subject: Celtic Knotwork

I have been hving trouble with my modem and have only been able to get
connection sporadically. I have somethimes been unable to conect with my
usual server, AOL, but have managed to connect to another server I use for
surfing the Net.

I tried to send the following article via AOL yesterday, but couldn't get a
connection. So I decided to send it by the other server. Everything went
well, and it was recorded as haveing been transmitted, but as far as I can
see, the message didn't reach the List.

I don't delibertely wish to duplicte messages, but I am getting through to
AOL this morning and I thought I should try gain. So here is my article on a
second attempt. I sincerely apologise to anyone who has already received it.

David Lister.

                             +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

                                     Celtic Knotwork

On 16th November Mary Stansbury wrote asking about the book "Celtic Knotwork"
by Iain Bain and whether it contained any origami. for some reason Amazon
Books had included it in their list of origami books.

There have been several replies, but I thought that perhaps a fuller reply
might be helpful.

I cannot think why Amazon thought fit to include "Celtic Knotwork" in a list
of books on origami. In the literal sense, they were very wrong. But on the
other hand, in another sense, perhaps they were more right than perhaps they
realised.

I have several times previously in Origami-L referred to the "Origami Mind",
meaning the sort of person who is attracted to origami. It may be difficult
for an origami enthusiast to understand, but only a small proportion of
people - perhaps a small proportion - are attracted to origami. The same
people are likely to be attracted to a number of other subjects. They
include, among other things, puzzles, string figures, knotting, conjuring,
tangrams, tessellations, recreational mathematics. The essence of them
appears to be structure based on mathematics, but not entirely so: there is
in all of them an element of unexpected surprise.

Celtic artwork is based on complex interwoven (or knotted) strands. It
develops with the elaboration of maze patterns, and the introduction of
highly stylised letters, animals and human beings. It appeared in sculptured
stonework, particularly in Celtic crosses, in metalwork enamels and woodwork,
but the highest development of the style is generally considered to be in the
art of illuminated manuscripts of the Celtic Church in Ireland and Northern
Britain and in particular, the Book of Kells, which belongs to Trinity
College, Dublin and the Lindisfarne Gospels, a book belonging to the British
Library.

The style of interlacement was not confined to the Celts. It s origins can be
seen in the La Tene culture in Europe. It was employed by the Anglo-Saxons of
England and by the Vikings of Scandinavia . It appears occasionally in the
art of later years. Even Leonardo da Vinci drew some very intricate knot
patterns based on the same principle.

As a style of art, knotwork was almost forgotten by the 19th century and
considered as something primitive and of interest only to antiquarians. One
of these was J. Romilly Allen, who gathered together examples of the
interlaced style and published several books on the subject. His work was
seminal in reviving interest in the subject However, it was still not
understood how the original artists managed to draw their extraordinarily
complex designs. The first artist to break through the maze was George Bain,
a Scotsman, who became interested in Pictish designs. (The Picts are now
considered to he been a branch of the Celts.) He worked out the underlying
principles of the patterns and in 1951, he published his "Celtic Art, The
Methods of Construction" which covers the whole range of Celtic pattern. His
work led to a strong revival of interest in the ancient patterns among
graphic artists, perhaps reacting against the lack of formalism in
contemporary art. One of the artists who has taken a particular interest in
the style is Courtney Davis who has created his own patterns and designs and
published several books containing his designs. He has also been in great
demand as an illustrator of books on Celtic subjects.

George Bain's methods still left too much to intuition for some people and
his work was taken up by his son Iain Bain, who had a career as a civil
engineer. As he approached retirement , he became fascinted by his father's
work and devised new techniques for drawing the interlaced patterns,
especially using underlying grid patterns. His book, "Celtic Knotwork" was
published in 1986. He has also written a sequel, "Celtic Key Patterns"
published in 1983. Others who have taken up the task of giving instruction on
the secrets of drawing Celtic patterns are Aidan Meehan who has written a
whole series of smaller books and Andy Sloss.

The technique of Celtic patterns is no longer a mystery and with the revival
of this beautiful art form, it has taken its place among the great variety of
forms of art that surround us. Modern artists are unlikely to achieve the
sublimity of the Book of Kells or the Lindisfarne Gospels, but their work is
showing great inspiration partly within the Celtic Revival.

It was George Bain's book that led to Mary Stansbury's original query. There
is really nothing in that book which could be considered to be origami, but
it would be possible to use some of the techniques to create kirigami figures
by folding the paper and then cutting out the interlaced patterns through the
several layers.

The nearest paper technique t that of Celtic Knotwork is perhaps, paper
weaving. Not long ago there was an enquiry about them in this List about
woven paper fishes and animals, a technique found not only in the West, but
also in the East. A study of the books on Celtic Knotwork might well be the
source of inspiration for an a wider and more intricate development of paper
weaving. But whether or not paperfolders find inspiration in Celtic knotwork
designs, this is certainly a subject that will appeal to all who possess the
"Origami Mind".

David Lister.

Grimsby, England.





From: Scott Cramer <scram@LANDMARKNET.NET>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 08:56
Subject: Re: A plea to Robert Lang-- bunnies!

hobbit gently chastised:

>on 99/11/17  Scott wrote to Rob Hudson
>
>>So the gift wrap was a success! Way to go!
>
>Scott, Do not fold ahead of the diagrams.
>
>hobbit

...and she's absolutely right. I'd hate to cause a flap, or sink something
inadvertently.

    But if Rob's relationship now depends on his being able to pass this
rabbit test, well, he's jumped ahead much further than I was suggesting.

Scott scram@landmarknet.net





From: "Mark Y. McKinnon" <mym@LUCENT.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 09:14
Subject: Compass rose

I know I've seen diagrams for a compass rose out on the web but I don't know
where. Does any know where those diagrams might be and who did them?

My daughter has to make a map this weekend.

Thanks for your help.





From: Mark Rae <m.rae@INPHARMATICA.CO.UK>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 09:14
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree

Xandra Leong wrote:
> I am wondering is there a real pretty X'mas tree diagram I can make out
> there? I want to make one so I can put all my ornaments up on it that I
> made.

I don't have any diagrams, but I will have a go at describing in words
a really simple 'modular' christmas tree, which I got from a book
somewhere in the dim and distant past.

Start with a square of paper, crease along the diagonals and the
two mid-lines and then collapse into the first stage of a bird base.

Fold all four bottom points up to the top* and then spread out the
four new corner points at 90 degrees to each other so that you have a
little pyramid/cross shape.

If you now turn it over so you are looking at it from the bottom, and
lift up each of the 'bottom' points in turn, you should be able to fold
half of the triangle in half again, so it forms a triangular flap
which you can then tuck into the neighbouring 'slot'.

When you have done all four sides, the whole thing should lock together
firmly, forming a pyramid with a flat base.
If you make a number of these of gradually increasing size you can
stack them together to form your christmas tree.

To make the trunk, before you fold the bottom four points up*, fold the
top edges of the bird base down so they lie along the vertical midline.
You now continue as before, except that the bottom points are now
folded up along the base of the new thinner triangle, rather than
the middle.

    -Mark

--
Mark Rae                                       Tel: +44(0)171 631 4644
Inpharmatica                                   Fax: +44(0)171 631 4844
m.rae@inpharmatica.co.uk                http://www.inpharmatica.co.uk/





From: Rob Hudson <FashFold@AOL.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 09:29
Subject: Re: A plea to Robert Lang-- bunnies!

Yes! that's correct-- my relationship hinges on the bunny!  If this bunny
were not to manifest itself, other things (or spirits) might!  Ponder how
wonderful it is that I have not had much spare time lately!

-R
(... I do recall hearing the voice of another Rob Lang speaking in my dreams
last night..)





From: "Shi-Yew Chen (a.k.a. Sy)" <sychen@EROLS.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 09:36
Subject: Re: Compass rose

In Origami Interest group:
ftp://ftp.rug.nl/origami/models/ornament/crose.gif by Jorma Oksanen

Happy folding!

Sy Chen

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Y. McKinnon <mym@LUCENT.COM>
To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:36:27 -0500
Subject: Compass rose

>I know I've seen diagrams for a compass rose out on the web but I don't
know
>where. Does any know where those diagrams might be and who did them?
>
>My daughter has to make a map this weekend.
>
>Thanks for your help.





From: Ronald Koh <ronkoh@SINGNET.COM.SG>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 10:30
Subject: Rob Hudson's Chick

> >on 99/11/17  Scott wrote to Rob Hudson
> >
> >>So the gift wrap was a success! Way to go!

Rob Hudson replied:

Yes! that's correct-- (snip)

Anybody knows where diagrams for a chicken coop can be found? What about
diagrams for a hatchery? Looks like Rob's going to need something like
these next, the way this relationship thing is going! :o)





From: Rona Gurkewitz <GURKEWITZ@WCSUB.CTSTATEU.EDU>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 11:42
Subject: Re: Celtic Knotwork

Amazon might have seen a knot book sold on Fascinating Folds website.
The book can be used for designs in knotting mizuhiki to go on
origami. Mizuhiki are paper cords.

Rona





From: Kellydunn2@AOL.COM
Date: 19 Nov 1999 12:19
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

In a message dated 11/19/99 7:51:59 AM, jupalffy@BLUEWIN.CH writes:

<< Kenneth (or was it Kelly?) wrote:
"Actually, tho I might be wrong about this, I think they started out
as animal sacrifices, and cheap ones at that, and are still used
as such in some religions. >>

Kenneth wrote it, not me not me not me!!!





From: Scott Cramer <scram@LANDMARKNET.NET>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 12:44
Subject: Re: Religion and Origami

Kenneth wrote:

>"Actually, tho I might be wrong about this, I think they started out
>as animal sacrifices, and cheap ones at that, and are still used
>as such in some religions. >>

    I made a sacrificial Kawahata triceratops the other day... the cat got
it off the counter. I didn't see this happen, I was told this is what
happened. I've also been told not to clutter the counter with origami
models. Coincidence?

    Just to be on the safe side, I'm going to have the cat altared.

Scott scram@landmarknet.net





From: Gillian Wiseman <gilladian@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 13:44
Subject: Re: Celtic Knotwork

David,
Great essay! I'm so glad you took the trouble to repost it.

I was thinking of the Aidan Meehan series when I replied earlier. I own a
couple of those, and one of Iain Bain's. They're all wonderful books.

Gillian Wiseman

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 14:40
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Religion and Origami

so sorry but I did not get to see that movie.. so I am not sure how it is..
hehe but this religion you can wear anything you want.. and you can be any
age, shape or size, gender.. and we promise to not give up folding something
if we get stuck but we try again sometime later.
and to always try and make time for our "folding time" hehe :P nice religion
eh? :P only one commandment. oh! and always carry some paper around hehe :P
Xandra

----- Original Message -----
From: "Matthias Gutfeldt" <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
To: <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 1999 12:00 AM
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Religion and Origami

>===== Original Message From Origami List <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU> =====
>okay I am apart of the origami religion.. hehe now I think I got many
>followers.. :P
>Xandra

Master Xandra: Do we get to wear cool paper pyramids, like in "Bowfinger" ?
Who created those pyramids? They looked a lot like Maarten van Gelder's
pyramid.

Matthias





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 14:51
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

okay I am catholic so I already know all those dove things.. well actually
now I have in the origami religion.. hehe :P okie being serious again.. I
just want to say one thing that I feel really makes sense.. OKAY we all know
dove means peace... and something to do with god and so on.. BUT is a real
alive flying one that means that not a piece of paper.. no no.. no paper
came flying out from the sky above it was a real dove.. so what are you guys
all on about by making 1000 cranes and stuff means god? no jesus did not
fold some birds.. what!? god did not too.. he got some real ones.. or was it
suppose to be like imaginary.. oh well I don't remember.. but whatever it
is.. is NOT paper.. and promoting 1000 cranes to fold when you are ill or
whatever for religion? that is stupid.. you are there ill.. and trying to
fold this birdie and staying up so late JUST makes you MORE ill! okay maybe
you don't have to fold.. people fold for you.. poor peaple they all busy
folding and no one prays?? useless.. see?
oh well I might get loads of shoe and vegetable thrown back to me by all you
religious people.. but I think my opinion makes sense.. and is only my
opinion.. free of speech like you said right? :P
Xandra

----- Original Message -----
From: "Julia Palffy" <jupalffy@BLUEWIN.CH>
To: <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 11:28 PM
Subject: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

Hello,
Kenneth (or was it Kelly?) wrote:
"Actually, tho I might be wrong about this, I think they started out
as animal sacrifices, and cheap ones at that, and are still used
as such in some religions.

With Jesus being a (symbolic?) sacrifice in the Christian religion,
the Dove then becomes a symbol for Jesus."

Please allow me to put a few things straight.
Actually, in the Christian religion (and before that in the Jewish
religion? please correct me if I'm mistaken), the dove symbolises peace
because, according to the Bible, it was the first bird sent out from Noah's
Ark that brought back something (a twig of olive), as a sign that the
waters of the Flood were subsiding, and that life on earth would be
possible again. This is the origin of the dove's symbolical meaning.
In the New Testament, the evangelist John writes that he saw the Holy
Spirit descend upon Jesus in the shape of a dove, which was for him (John),
the sign that Jesus was really sent by God. Thus the dove became the symbol
for the Holy Spirit in Christianity. BTW, the sacrifical animal with which
Jesus is connected is not the dove, but the lamb.

Any confusion between the dove and the crane as symbols of peace will be
due to their common symbolism and modern syncretism.

As to Christianity being a martial religion - that certainly wasn't the
original message, even though enough has been done to deserve that
definition!

The Swastika of Nazi Germany does not come from the Roman cross (if
anything, the cross with equal branches is called a Greek cross, and the
cross (in many variations) already was a symbol in other religions long
before Christianity existed, cf. the Ankh), but is (interestingly) the
mirror image of the Hindu Swastika which was a symbol of peace and good
wishes. The reversing of the symbol may have meant also a reversal of its
meaning!

Instead of making global judgements about any religion, I'd like to say
that all of them have somewhere in their Holy Books the Golden Rule - Treat
others as you want to be treated. Moses, Buddha, Jesus and Mohammed (if
there are others you'd like mentioned, you are welcome to complete the
list) were originally concerned about finding ways for people to live
realistically and peacefully together. So why don't we use our energy to
put into practice what they understood about that, instead of wasting it
hitting each other on the head to prove that one was better than the other?

To move on to something else Kenneth wrote about, writing as originally
invented in the "western" part of the world (as in relation to the Far East
and without considering the Far West for the moment being, otherwise it
gets too complicated!) - well, to be short in Sumer & Babylon & Egypt,
seems to have been used first for commercial purposes, then for religious
and legal purposes, but people did not yet have enough self-awareness to
write literature as we understand it. (to anyone who is interested in
knowing more about this, I recommend reading "The Gifts of the Jews" by
Thomas Cahill).

As to women writers, although nowadays the European Middle Ages get
described as obscurantist and anti-feministic, there were quite a lot of
women in the 12th and 13th century who left lasting literary works - the
Lays of Marie de France and the City of Ladies of Christine de Pisan in
France, the works of Hildegard von Bingen in Germany and Julian of Norwich
in England (probably there are more, but these are the names I can remember
right now). And they were probably freer to express themselves than English
women in the 19th century, when George Eliot and the Bronte sisters had to
use male pseudonyms to get published, because writing wasn't considered an
activity suitable for women! However, because of this freedom, medieval
European women did not actually have to develop a different script like
their Japanese sisters...

Kenneth, I find your contributions most stimulating! :)

Now I guess I'll get off the soapbox and back to folding... :o)

Julia ("Should've been a schoolmarm !") Palffy
Zug, Switzerland
jupalffy@bluewin.ch

__________
I__I__I__I__I
I__I__I__I__I
I__I__I__I__I
I__I__I__I__I   There are more possibilities than you imagine.





From: Robby/Laura <morassi@ZEN.IT>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 14:51
Subject: Re: Buckyballs,

Dave,
At 17.38 18/11/1999 EST, you wrote:
>Im trying again now...

>Have fun.

OK, I've seen it now and I've had fun..... but please DON'T send
attachments to the list any more ! Nothing personal, just think of what
would happen if all 500+ list members suddenly decided to follow your
example and sent their own attachments: diagrams, photo's or anything
else..... That would mean hours (and money.....) wasted on downloading the
whole bunch, not to speak of hard disk occupation and Internet bandwidth
crowding !

I know that this is highly unlikely, but it's a matter of principle and of
Netiquette.... sorry, it wasn't me who invented it.... :-)

Also, it might be that 99% of the origami-listers were not interested at
all in downloading your buckyball module..... The correct way, if you don't
have access to a server where to put your GIF for downloading, is a message
like "I have diagrams for a buckyball module, it's a GIF file of XXX
kbytes, anyone interested please e-mail me privately".

I thought this all was taken for granted. Sorry again.

Roberto

PS By the way, scanning as 256 grey-tone scale (not B/W) and reducing the
size to about 800x600 pixels would be of great help if one wanted to see
the diagrams on screen in one shot.... ;-)





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 15:25
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree! ^-^ Thanks

hey thanks so sooooooooo very much! Although I normally hate reading text
because I find it sometime a little confusing but this one is real good.. I
get how to do it and it looks great.. now all I have to do is make more.. :P
I would call you and say thanx but I am no longer living in uk :P

With many Thanks
Xandra

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Rae" <m.rae@INPHARMATICA.CO.UK>
To: <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 1999 6:14 AM
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree

Xandra Leong wrote:
> I am wondering is there a real pretty X'mas tree diagram I can make out
> there? I want to make one so I can put all my ornaments up on it that I
> made.

I don't have any diagrams, but I will have a go at describing in words
a really simple 'modular' christmas tree, which I got from a book
somewhere in the dim and distant past.

Start with a square of paper, crease along the diagonals and the
two mid-lines and then collapse into the first stage of a bird base.

Fold all four bottom points up to the top* and then spread out the
four new corner points at 90 degrees to each other so that you have a
little pyramid/cross shape.

If you now turn it over so you are looking at it from the bottom, and
lift up each of the 'bottom' points in turn, you should be able to fold
half of the triangle in half again, so it forms a triangular flap
which you can then tuck into the neighbouring 'slot'.

When you have done all four sides, the whole thing should lock together
firmly, forming a pyramid with a flat base.
If you make a number of these of gradually increasing size you can
stack them together to form your christmas tree.

To make the trunk, before you fold the bottom four points up*, fold the
top edges of the bird base down so they lie along the vertical midline.
You now continue as before, except that the bottom points are now
folded up along the base of the new thinner triangle, rather than
the middle.

    -Mark

--
Mark Rae                                       Tel: +44(0)171 631 4644
Inpharmatica                                   Fax: +44(0)171 631 4844
m.rae@inpharmatica.co.uk                http://www.inpharmatica.co.uk/





From: Casida Mark <casida@ERE.UMONTREAL.CA>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 15:57
Subject: Re: Maekawa's Devil (was Demon)

No origami content (sorry).

It was recently suggested that words such as
      "anglophone"
      "francophone"
      "allophone"
are Canadian words meant to describe Canadian society
and require explanation to nonCanadians (e.g. English).
Is this true?

                      ... Mark
--
*-------------------------------------------------------*
|          Mark E. Casida                               |
|                  Mark.Casida@umontreal.ca             |





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 17:32
Subject: [NO] Canadian words?

At 15:55 99/11/19 -0500, you wrote:
>No origami content (sorry).
>
>It was recently suggested that words such as
>      "anglophone"
>      "francophone"
>      "allophone"
>are Canadian words meant to describe Canadian society
>and require explanation to nonCanadians (e.g. English).
>Is this true?

"Anglophone" and "francophone" are not exclusively Canadian. Anglophone
means "consisting of or belonging to an English-speaking population,
especially in a country where two or more languages are spoken." Francophone
is the same thing applied to French speakers. So, while the words are
particularly appropriate in Canada (where English and French are the two
official languages), they are not Canadian words.

"Allophone" is unrelated. It means "one of two or more variants of the same
phoneme." The example that my dictionary gives is the difference between the
aspirated \p\ of "pin" and the unaspirated \p\ of "spin".

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Doug Philips <dwp@TRANSARC.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 17:53
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree! ^-^ Thanks

Xandra Leong, in reply to Mark Rae's description of a unit origami tree,
indited:
> hey thanks so sooooooooo very much! Although I normally hate reading text
> because I find it sometime a little confusing but this one is real good.. I
> get how to do it and it looks great.. now all I have to do is make more.. :P
> I would call you and say thanx but I am no longer living in uk :P

It is a nice tree, one of the few fully three dimensional ones at that.

In case anyone is wondering whose tree it is and where they can find
diagrams...

It sounds like the Christmas Tree model independently discovered/created by
Rae Cooker and Makoto Yamaguchi. It can be found in The Magic of Origami by
Alice Gray and Kunihiko Kasahara as well as in Origami: Paperfolding for Fun
(only credited to Yamaguchi) by Eric Kenneway.

(The above information was obtained from the Origami USA model index, courtesy
OUSA: http://www.origami-usa.org/)

I think I've seen it diagrammed in a few other places, but can't recall where
at the moment.

-D'gou





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 18:02
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

At 11:50 99/11/19 -0800, you wrote:
>so what are you guys
>all on about by making 1000 cranes and stuff means god? no jesus did not
>fold some birds.

>okay maybe you don't have to fold.. people fold for you.. poor peaple they
>all busy folding and no one prays?? useless.. see?

>oh well I might get loads of shoe and vegetable thrown back to me by all you
>religious people.. but I think my opinion makes sense.. and is only my
>opinion.. free of speech like you said right? :P

Xandra: two things for you to think about.

1. You've missed the point on the 1000 cranes. No one said that making 1000
cranes means God/Jesus. That is based on a Japanese belief and has nothing
to do with Christianity.

[Aside: Besides, what is prayer? "And pray in the Spirit on all occasions
with all kinds of prayers and requests." (Eph. 6:18) "Do everything in
love." (1 Cor. 16:14) "So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it
all for the glory of God." (1 Cor. 10:31) Why can folding cranes for
someone, as an expression of love and concern for them, not be a form of
prayer?]

2. When replying to other people's messages, remember that everyone on the
list has already read (or ignored) them. It is not only a waste of people's
time to have to wade through all of the original message when you reply, it
also costs some people money (longer download times means higher phone
charges). Please be considerate of the other 500+ people on this list and
edit down your replies. Thank you.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 18:52
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

Well no1 that rule you said about relying without full message blahh blahh
was not one of the rules in the mailing list so I had no idea. OKAY? oh and
I was replying that mail not to you thank you.. and I was saying it in the
Catholic way if you could read..and I did not say generally.. thank you..
and I think what most people do to pray is not fold.. because no god did
that.. and not in any bible or anything says that.. so that is why I think
it has no relation at all.. and in the love of god? folding for god? it all
sounds weird.. I mean if you go and do something uselfull like help a child
that seems more in love for god and others and you are doing something
usefull what good does folding something do? maybe if you sell it afterwards
and give the money to charity that is all..
Xandra





From: David Taylor <dataylor@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 18:52
Subject: Re: "Francophone," etc

I want this one! My part-time job is writing abstracts of language &
linguistics articles. (No, I'm not a linguist, just a former French major.)
"Anglophone" & "Francophone" are real words & are capitalized in English.
"Allophone" is a linguistics term you'd be better off looking up, if you're
curious.
--Elise
>It was recently suggested that words such as
>      "anglophone"
>      "francophone"
>      "allophone"
>are Canadian words meant to describe Canadian society
>and require explanation to nonCanadians (e.g. English).
>Is this true?
>
>                      ... Mark





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 18:55
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree! ^-^ Thanks

yep is so good turning out.. (still trying to build it.. :P) anyway what
part of uk do you live? you know I never knew so many people loved origami
in uk.. because it was always hard to find books and so on in uk a bit I
thought.. I lived in UK for 9 years if you are wondering how long.
Xandra

---------------------
In case anyone is wondering whose tree it is and where they can find
diagrams...

It sounds like the Christmas Tree model independently discovered/created by
Rae Cooker and Makoto Yamaguchi. It can be found in The Magic of Origami by
Alice Gray and Kunihiko Kasahara as well as in Origami: Paperfolding for Fun
(only credited to Yamaguchi) by Eric Kenneway.

(The above information was obtained from the Origami USA model index,
courtesy
OUSA: http://www.origami-usa.org/)

I think I've seen it diagrammed in a few other places, but can't recall
where
at the moment.

-D'gou





From: David Taylor <dataylor@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 18:59
Subject: Re: "Francophone," etc, Reprise

I didn't finish answering Mark's question, did I? An Anglophone speaks
English; a Francophone speaks French; a Lusophone speaks Portuguese...
--Elise





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 19:35
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

[NOTE: This is getting a little too far off topic, I think. This message
will be my last on this thread. I will respond privately to any further
messages on this thread.]

At 15:50 99/11/19 -0800, Xandra wrote:
>Well no1 that rule you said about relying without full message blahh blahh
>was not one of the rules in the mailing list so I had no idea. OKAY?

Simple etiquette, Xandra, and something that has been mentioned many times
on this list. (I guess I should really get back to getting that list FAQ
rewritten...too many things to do, too little time.) Take a deep breath and
cool down. That was not an attack, but a response to your comments. For
someone who claims to support free speech, you seem quite intolerant of
allowing that luxury to anyone else. (Now THAT was an attack...but only a
mild one. Try to be a little more open-minded. Don't debate, especially in a
public forum, if you can't take the heat.)

>oh and
>I was replying that mail not to you thank you.

Right. But you did so publicly to the list, and as a member of the list, I
can respond. Free speech again, remember?

>and I was saying it in the
>Catholic way if you could read..and I did not say generally.. thank you..

Yes, I can read. Perhaps you cannot? No one in the previous messages on this
topic mentioned folding 1000 cranes as being a part of Catholicism. Somehow,
you made this connection. I merely pointed out this out to you.

>and I think what most people do to pray is not fold.. because no god did
>that.. and not in any bible or anything says that.. so that is why I think
>it has no relation at all.. and in the love of god? folding for god? it all
>sounds weird.. I mean if you go and do something uselfull like help a child
>that seems more in love for god and others and you are doing something
>usefull what good does folding something do? maybe if you sell it afterwards
>and give the money to charity that is all..

Well, then, how do you explain the verses I quoted, especially this one: "So
whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of
God." (1 Cor. 10:31)? Just because something is weird does not mean that it
is wrong. The Bible is full of things that are "weird" (as are other holy
books), and yet many people believe them. I would assume that you believe
them, too. Why do you find it so hard to accept that someone can use their
talents in a prayerful manner? It is no harder to believe than someone
walking on water, or ascending into heaven, or feeding a huge crowd with 5
loaves of bread.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Dave Stephenson <EruditusD@AOL.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 19:39
Subject: NO: Re: Buckyballs

> OK, I've seen it now and I've had fun..... but please DON'T send
>  attachments to the list any more ! Nothing personal,

Nothing personal, but I still don't know how the first one appeared on the
list. It was sent to a Hot mail address and just appeared in the Ori mailing
list. Id give Mulder and Skully a call, the Internet is obviously possessed.

>>Also, it might be that 99% of the origami-listers were not interested at
>>all in downloading your buckyballs module.....

Incidentally a total of 87 people contacted me privately for the diagram
which is why I hammered at my poor system until it finally sent the damned
attachment to the list...

>>That would mean hours (and money.....)

I have 0800 access Mwah ha haaa ahhhh hahhahahah etc.

Anyhow... I've already apologised right after the first one and it even gave
an address as to where you could send your flame, so for gods sake keep your
lectures to yourself (No matter how polite),... so there :P

Dave-(Not in a good mood)-S





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:02
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

You know you are making me fall asleep.. it was my opinion at the start you
did not had to blaahhh on (I don't bother read long comments like that) and
that what made me say such thing to you.. don't take it personally okie?
chill.. I am chill.. and all it was is that I did not feel folding was apart
of god... that is all okie? happy? I am happy are you?
Xandra





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:04
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

Hi this is David.  I came back after awhile and was enjoying reading these
hilariously pedestrian ideas on origami and religion and I thought I would
say something to Xandra:

You don't have to attack Joseph Wu just for asking you to keep down the
replies.  You don't need a written rule to know common sense, but it's
nothing to be upset about alot of people forget to do that.  I appreciate
reading your opinion of folding cranes, but your view of what is prayer and
what is right is narrowed down to what you were taught to believe.  Expand
your vision!  Folding a thousand cranes or even folding a crane or a dove
in a way can be a form of prayer.  You simply attack anyone who doesn't see
what you think is truth.  But what is truth?  In my mind there is no
absolute truth only relative truths.  Just the very reality we accept is
just our conception of reality rendered by language games constructed in
our minds.   Well now I'll go back to lurking.  Have a good weekend!

Sincerely,

David





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:12
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

Is free of speach right? why are you commenting then? and was I talking to
you? hmmmmm very rude you are.. no manners at all.. I just feel is hilarious
you think folding is praying.. you know it all sounds so funny. and when did
I attack joseph? hmm did I say anything rude or swear I don't think I did..
please remind me.. I said thank you to him is that rude?
Xandra





From: Doug Philips <dwp@TRANSARC.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:19
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

Xandra indited:

+of god... that is all okie? happy? I am happy are you?

Wunnerful! Wunnerful!

Speaking of the holidays and religions (without revealing mine)...

There is a creche scene by Ligia Montoya in Secrets of Origami by
Harbin (recently reprinted by Dover and readily available), for those
interested. I've never folded it, nor have I seen a folded version, so
I can't comment on the models.

My favorite angel model is Neale Elias' which is available in Magic
Inc's The Flapping Bird (which is available from OUSA
http://www.origami-usa.org/ as well as Magic Inc itself (in Chicago).
The Magic Inc website address is in the archives.

And what is winter without snow? (At least in the North and East, or
South for those in Australia and South America)

My favorite snowflake is, of course, Joseph Wu's (available from his
website http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca/). My second favorite (its a
close second, but distinctly second ;-) ) is Lewis Simon's Snow
Crystal, from Toshie Takahama's book Creative Life with Creative
Origami, Volume III, which might still be available from OUSA, and
probably also from Sasuga (http://www.sasugabooks.com/).

-Daddy-o "Don't Worry, Be Happy" D'gou





From: Doug Philips <dwp@TRANSARC.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:23
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree! ^-^ Thanks

Xandra inquired:

+yep is so good turning out.. (still trying to build it.. :P) anyway what
+part of uk do you live? you know I never knew so many people loved origami
+in uk.. because it was always hard to find books and so on in uk a bit I
+thought.. I lived in UK for 9 years if you are wondering how long.

Too bad you never hooked up with the British Origami Society, which has
been around for over 30 years now, if I recall my anniversary issues
correctly.

Never lived in the UK, amn't livin' there now either. ;-). Stayed in
Winchester for a week once, on business.

-D'gou





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:23
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

hehe :P I am okie.. I am not mad at all.. :P haha I dont' get mad so
easily.. it is all an opinion anyway..
Happy folding all!
Xandra

----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Philips" <dwp@TRANSARC.COM>
To: <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 1999 5:16 PM
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Religion and Origami (long)

Xandra indited:

+of god... that is all okie? happy? I am happy are you?

Wunnerful! Wunnerful!





From: Xandra Leong <Xandra@SOCAL.RR.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:29
Subject: Re: X'mas Tree! ^-^ Thanks

yeah I knew they were around.. but I never cared to look at origami online
that much in uk.. I had too much school work to do no free time like that at
all.. well now I am in the us.. and sadly I see all the events in NY and
so... too far.. =( oh well.. what is the most favourite thing you like top
fold? I like to fold 3d star.. because chinese says that they are liek lucky
star and if you fold however many your wish can come true.. ^-^

--------------------------------------------

Too bad you never hooked up with the British Origami Society, which has
been around for over 30 years now, if I recall my anniversary issues
correctly.

Never lived in the UK, amn't livin' there now either. ;-). Stayed in
Winchester for a week once, on business.

-D'gou





From: Rob Moes <robmoes@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:32
Subject: Re: Holographic paper - Mylar

>I am in the same situation as Carol - got a couple of lovely rolls of
>holographic gift "paper"... well, synthetic stuff which won't hold folds
>(so I suppose it's Mylar).
>I haven't tried yet, but I was thinking of laminating it with some thin,
>crisp tissue paper. Has anyone tried this? If so, could you tell us whether
>this might work?

I do not think this will work because you need a backing substance which
will hold a crease sufficiently well to offset the "elastic" property of
the mylar.  My suggestion would be just plain aluminum foil.

Beware of the glue that you use....I can only recommend 3M spray glue (or
equivalent) and not any of the cheaper imitations, due to the fact that
neither the mylar nor the foil is porous.  I have never tried Rollataq, so
I don't know if this would be workable as a bonding agent.

Rob





From: John Hancock <jwhancock34@YAHOO.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:34
Subject: Request for Pointers (not the kind that messes the carpet)

Does anyone know of any origami models relating to
Japanese anime characters? I have seen a few scattered
models here and there, but thought (hoped?) there
might be a site or book dedicated to the topic. I am
also interested in origami adapted to Native American
or Hawaiian themes. Any pointers to such material
would be much appreciated. (Sorry about the lack of
religious content...forgive me?)

Satirically yours,

John

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com





From: P Bailey <pbailey@OPENCOMINC.COM>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:36
Subject: Re: NO:RE: was: Re:????

Xandra Leong wrote:
Hmmm!! Xuxa....Xandra.....????

Almost enough to make one wonder isn't it?

Perry
--
"Hope is a little thing
with feathers
perched in the soul all day,
it does it's little business
and then it flies away!"

Victor Buono from "It could be verse"

http://www.afgsoft.com/perry/           <--Website w/ diagrams!
Icq 23622644





From: Kim Best <kim.best@M.CC.UTAH.EDU>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 20:36
Subject: Apology, my BOS 200 crack

I would just like to apologise to anyone who was offended by response to
Rick Beech's request for diagram.

I remarks were intended as a joke concerning a late night American
television new program, name "Hard Copy".  They were not intended as any
kind of real criticism of Rick's request.

I think Rick has done some great things since he has become the editor
of the BOS newsletter.  And I appreciate his request for diagrams.

--
Kim Best                            *******************************
                                    *          Origamist:         *
Rocky Mountain Cancer Data System   * Some one who thinks paper   *
420 Chipeta Way #120                * thin, means thick and bulky *
Salt Lake City, Utah  84108         *******************************





From: Cathy <cathypl@GENERATION.NET>
Date: 19 Nov 1999 21:32
Subject: Re: [NO] Canadian words?

At 02:26 PM 99-11-19 -0800, you wrote:
>
>"Allophone" is unrelated. It means "one of two or more variants of the same
>phoneme." The example that my dictionary gives is the difference between the
>aspirated \p\ of "pin" and the unaspirated \p\ of "spin".
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------
>Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer

In Quebec we use this term to denote speakers of languages other than
French or English.

                        Cathy
******^^^^^*****^^^^^*****

Cathy Palmer-Lister
Ste. Julie, Quebec
Canada
cathypl@generation.net
