




From: pahoover <pahoover@WANS.NET>
Date: 14 Oct 1999 17:46
Subject: Re: unsubscribe

    -----Original Message-----
    From: pahoover <pahoover@wans.net>
    To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
    Date: Tuesday, October 12, 1999 8:30 PM
    Subject: unsubscribe

UNSUBSCRIBE!





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 14 Oct 1999 18:19
Subject: Intern at OUSA (was Re: The Paper (Am I Alone in This?))

At 23:50 99/10/13 -0700, you wrote:
>Of the many things that are in motion, one development that is particularly
>exciting is that there will soon be an intern on staff at OUSA for one year,
>straight from (and sponsored by) the design studios of Yamaguchi-san's
>Origami House - the producer of the Tanteidan Magazine.

The intern is already there. His name is TAJIRI Atsushi, and I had the
pleasure of spending time with him at Tokyo when I was visiting Origami
House. Tajiri-san is a fine diagrammer, and is responsible for the diagrams
in many of the familiar Origami House publications (often considered to be
Origami Tanteidan publications). You may have seen his work in Kawahata's
"Origami Fantasy" (I'm not sure which models he did in either of those
books) and Fuse's "The Mask".

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Paul Jackson <Mpjackson@BTINTERNET.COM>
Date: 14 Oct 1999 19:01
Subject: 'Realistic'.

Joseph Wu wrote:

> Think first about motivation. Why were the models created? Kawahata
>wanted  to present "realistic" models.

The description of complex origami as 'realistic' has long puzzled me.
Paper as a material and origami as a technique would seem to be about
as poor a way to represent realism as it is possible to find.

Consider these aspects of the outward appearance of an origami animal:
-the scale isn't realistic (usually)
-the colour isn't realistic
-the texture isn't realistic
-the weight isn't realistic
-the temperature isn't realistic
-the smell isn't realistic
-the movement isn't realistic
...not to mention the reality of emotion, character, symbolism and
metaphor beyond the superficial outward appearance of an origami
animal.

In fact, I can't think of anything about any origami animal that I
would consider 'realistic' (the fact that the species of an animal can
usually be deduced from its folded illustrative likeness is nothing to
do with 'realism').  And as many creators have demonstrated, 'realism'
is not necessarily a consequence of an accumulation of anatomical
detail -- there is also much 'realism' in simplicity.  Indeed, one
could argue that the greater the detail, the greater is the degree of
abstraction, not of realism.

The Dutch painter Piet Mondrian said that all representational art was
abstraction, and that the only realism in art lay in abstract art,
since it was representing only the reality of itself.  In origami
terms, perhaps we should begin to describe geometric and modular work
as 'realistic' (since such work represents only the reality of itself)
and describe complex illustrative origami by another term.  My
suggestion is 'anatomically detailed' for living creatures, and a
second term, 'illustratively detailed' for manufactured objects.  I'm
open to better suggestions.

I'm not questionning the validity of complex, so-called 'realistic'
origami as a creative/aesthetic challenge, but I would like to see the
inappropriate use of the word 'realistic' forever banished as a
description of complex work.

I know the use/misuse of this word is an old and esoteric origami
topic, and apologise to the geezers for pedantically re-treading old
ground.

I'm off to put my head in a bucket of ice...

Paul Jackson





From: Elaina Quackenbush <elaina_quackenbush@NETZERO.NET>
Date: 14 Oct 1999 19:59
Subject: Re: paper supplies

>Leigh asked:
>
>>Does anybody know where I can get decent sized (30cm+) foil
>
>    You can get 25cm squares from OUSA, both Japanese (very thin) and
>American (heavier). I'd be interested to learn where I could find anything
>larger, too...

I have luck finding things at fascinating folds, usually they have a variety
of papers, etc. that may help.

El

www.fascinating-folds.com

__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html





From: Wendi Curtis <rebelgami@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 14 Oct 1999 20:26
Subject: Re: paper supplies

Have you tried Kim's Crane?  They seem to have a wonderful supply of origami
papers and books.  Their mail service is really fast too!
http://www.kimscrane.com
WC

>From: Leigh Halford <Leigh451@AOL.COM>
>Reply-To: Origami List <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
>To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: paper supplies
>Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 16:21:16 EDT
>
>Does anybody know where I can get decent sized (30cm+) foil, rather than
>the
>piddly little 15cm squares I can get at my local shop, in dear old England.
>Before anybody suggests cutting it myself I am useless at cutting squares!!
>Ta
>

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Rjlang@AOL.COM
Date: 14 Oct 1999 23:03
Subject: Re: Newcomer and Question

David whitbeck wrote:

>>>>
1. the models in Prehistoric Origami are a joke.  They're mostly two
dimensional and very boxy.  They're like volvo dinosaurs.  Even the ever
popular stegosaurus is flat and doesn't even have a back...[snip]...I would
never think that comparing those two books is like comparing Beethoven and
Mozart.  Prehistoric Origami is not that good.
<<<<

David, you're missing some history. Prehistoric Origami was published in
1989, composed of models designed in the mid-80's, still the dark ages (okay,
the early Renaissance) of complex origami design. The first time Montroll
showed his Stegosaurus at a FOCA convention, it caused a major sensation
because nobody had ever done or seen anything remotely like it (browse the
OUSA archives sometime to see what used to pass for a "Stegosaurus" -- you
got three plates if you were lucky). Among the people who were impressed and
affected by this model was a young Japanese folder named Kawahata, who said
(be forewarned, I am attempting to remember a paraphrase of a translation)
that "this model was the one that convinced me that anything was possible
with origami," and the rest, of course, is history. It should be no surprise
that models in Origami Fantasy are more "advanced" than those in Prehistoric
Origami; without taking anything away from the genius of Kawahata (by my
reckoning, the designer of the most technically sophisticated models in the
world today), Origami Fantasy was built on the foundation laid by Prehistoric
Origami.

Robert





From: Rjlang@AOL.COM
Date: 14 Oct 1999 23:05
Subject: The Origami Man

This just in: a friend of Diane's wanted to introduce her mother to Diane,
and so she told the mother, "you've met her, I think; she's the wife of the
origami man."

The mother said, "oh yes, the origami people...now, I don't want to sound
prejuduced, but...what color is their skin?"

The same as that of all the other people in Origamistan, I suppose. ;o)

Robert





From: Meristein@AOL.COM
Date: 14 Oct 1999 23:18
Subject: Re: The Origami Man

In a message dated 10/14/99 11:07:43 PM, you wrote:

<<oh yes, the origami people...now, I don't want to sound
prejuduced, but...what color is their skin?">>

Why, coloured on one side and patterned on the other, I think...or are those
just the folks from Duo Province?

Merida(a folder of a different stripe)





From: Doug Philips <dwp@TRANSARC.COM>
Date: 14 Oct 1999 23:22
Subject: Re: Complex vs. Intermediate folders [Was Re: Paper Diagrams]

Lisa Hodsdon indited:

+I *suspect* that we have a higher percentage of complex folders here
+on the list than are in the OUSA membership. The Bell Curve in action.

Perhaps. But remember not all of the OUSA membership can get to the
convention, so I suspect that the convention is also not a good
sampling. My guess is (from personal anecdotal evidence) that complex
folders don't have as much a need/drive to get the convention, even
assuming that the economic means is evenly, or randomly, distributed
amongst the members. And those complex folders who do attend a
convention don't always do it to attend the complex classes. I spend
Saturday and Sunday teaching, knowing/hoping that I'll be able to learn
the models that really wow me (whatever their level) during the after
hours folding. I think both economics and complex-folder-itis tend to
skew the results.

-D'gou





From: Rjlang@AOL.COM
Date: 14 Oct 1999 23:32
Subject: Re: Diagrams in new Tanteidan issue #57

JacAlArt wrote:

>>>>
Also -- an interesting article by or about Robert Lang dealing
with geometry and divisons of paper. Sure wish it was in English as I can't
read Japanese. Too bad some English language publication doesn't have enough
pages for an article like this. Guess more people wanted to hear about
someone's lunch with Tomoko Fuse.
<<<<

JacAlArt must be referring to some "English language publication" other than
_The Paper_, since the latter will be printing an English version of these
same articles, starting, I believe, in the December issue.

Robert





From: P Bailey <pbailey@OPENCOMINC.COM>
Date: 14 Oct 1999 23:51
Subject: Re: Tanteidan????

"Askinazi, Brett" wrote:
> The annual is published in Japanese, but the diagrams (in most cases *cough*
> Gamera *cough*) are very clear and concise.

You mean I'm not the only one who can't fold the Gamera diagrams!  Gasp!
may be it isn't just me!

Perry (Who can't figure that one out either!)
8?')>
--
"Each time he shifted gears he did it as if the Moment of Truth
had arrived in a bullfight"
H. Allen Smith "The Pig in the Barber Shop"

http://www.afgsoft.com/perry/           <--Website w/ diagrams!
Icq 23622644





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 00:34
Subject: Re: 'Realistic'.

In that sense realistic is a bad word.  But look at it this way: realism is
the unattainable dream that drives many to create models that explore the
three dimensional nature and complexity of animals more.  Perhaps it's not
good to describe an origami model as realistic but it shouldn't be thrown
out of our vocabulary.

David





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 00:34
Subject: Re: Newcomer and Question

I see your points (to both Joseph Wu and Robert J. Lang).  I was a little
extreme but my point is if today you were going to choose what book to buy
I would go with Origami Fantasy.  I blew everything a little out of
proportion, I'm sorry.

David





From: Hatori Koshiro <hatori@JADE.DTI.NE.JP>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 02:30
Subject: Re: Tanteidan????

Askinazi, Brett said

> Ok the Tanteidan is an Origami Club/organization based in Japan.  They
> publish a newsletter, and annually have a convention.  The convention
> produces an annual of model diagrams that were displayed/taught at that
> years convention.

Just a correction.
Tanteidan WAS origami organization until this April.
The organization changed its name into JOAS (Japan Origami Academic
Society).
Now Tanteidan is the name of magazines and annuals.

 _ _ _ _ _
|         |  Hatori Koshiro (Koshiro is my first name.)
|_._._._._|          hatori@jade.dti.ne.jp
|         |      http://www.jade.dti.ne.jp/~hatori/
|_ _ _ _ _|_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
 If they keep on risking failure, they're still artists. (S.Jobs)





From: Julia Palffy <jupalffy@BLUEWIN.CH>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 02:39
Subject: Re: The Origami Man

Maybe you should have told her we are the rainbow-coloured ones?

Julia Palffy
Zug, Switzerland
jupalffy@bluewin.ch





From: Dr Stephen O'Hanlon <fishgoth@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 04:51
Subject: Re: Newcomer and Question

>David whitbeck wrote:
>
> >>>>
>1. the models in Prehistoric Origami are a joke.  They're mostly two
>dimensional and very boxy.  They're like volvo dinosaurs.  Even the ever
>popular stegosaurus is flat and doesn't even have a back...[snip]...I would
>never think that comparing those two books is like comparing Beethoven and
>Mozart.  Prehistoric Origami is not that good.

I rather like it. Supercomplex origami has its place, and I find it the most
fun to fold. However, this book has a series of intermediate and above
models that are delightful as display models. Also, my sister, when aged
ten, picked up this book from my collection, and a day later proudly
displayed her parasaurolophus to me that she had folded. Three years later,
her bedroom is becoming littered with origami. Surely it is events like this
which define the appeal of such collections, rather that the resultant
haemorrhaging of ones fingers from folding them?

Perhaps a comparison of Beethoven and Mozart isnt that helpful (Beethovens
way better, according to my taste). After all, everyone can hum a few Mozart
tunes, but can anyone name a popular symphony of his? Perhaps a comparison
of Picasso and Miro may be in order; delightful complexity verses accessible
popular simplicity.

Yours arty-f*rty,

Stephen

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Dr Stephen O'Hanlon <fishgoth@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 04:55
Subject: Re: The Origami Man

>This just in: a friend of Diane's wanted to introduce her mother to Diane,
>and so she told the mother, "you've met her, I think; she's the wife of the
>origami man."
>
>The mother said, "oh yes, the origami people...now, I don't want to sound
>prejuduced, but...what color is their skin?"
>
>The same as that of all the other people in Origamistan, I suppose. ;o)
>
>Robert

Ive got a nice Elephant hide skin, although I'm working on a tan.

If it's any consolation, my ex-girlfriend at Cambridge continually
introduced me as the 'Origami boy'. I evidently need to take a big step up
in the world to reach Mr Lang's revered status.
Stephen

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Anine Cleve <anine20@USA.NET>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 07:18
Subject: Can you help me?

Hi!

Sorry to bother you again :P

I'd like to have an origami model standing somewhere in my room which would
make people impressed and of course it would have to be one I had made. I'm
thinking of maybe a Pegasus or a dinosaur skeleton if it's something special,
other suggestions are more than welcome! I'd be happy if you would write me if
you have a suggestion and give me the URL to the diagram online or if
necessary tell me which book it is in.
I'd also like if someone knows a model that is made of several parts but each
part is not too difficult to make and in the end you get a great result. I
don't mean all those cubes you can make from joining units, but something
different!
Thanks in advance!
                      Anine

____________________________________________________________________
Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1





From: Scott Cramer <scram@LANDMARKNET.NET>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 10:31
Subject: Meeting announcement

    The October meeting of the Littleton-Lancaster NH group will be this
Sunday, October 17th, from 1:00 on at the Weeks Memorial Library on Main St.
in Lancaster.
    Everyone is welcome- come have some folding fun!

Scott scram@landmarknet.net
Littleton, NH USA





From: Nick Robinson <nick@CHEESYPEAS.DEMON.CO.UK>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 10:52
Subject: Re: Amazing origami story

Rob Hudson <FashFold@AOL.COM> sez

>Lunch with Fuse?  I  can top that.
>One time Akira Yoshizawa came to my house to use the bathroom.'

Kids stuff - Dave Brill, Ted Norminton & myself made beautiful music
together in my bedroom....

all the best,

Nick Robinson

email           nick@cheesypeas.demon.co.uk
homepage        http://www.cheesypeas.demon.co.uk - now featuring soda syphons!
BOS homepage    http://www.rpmrecords.co.uk/bos/





From: Gilad Aharoni <Gilad.Aharoni@ICC.CO.IL>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 11:03
Subject: Re: Can you help me?

My living room (and the rest of the house, too...) is littered with all sorts
of origami models, but I noticed that most of the OOOH's and AAH's I get
from visitors come from Issei Yoshino's T.Rex skeleton (found in his book
"A Skeleton of a Tyrannosaurus Rex") which, since it rests on top of a tall
bookcase, is not noticed immediatly on entering the room, but upon seeing
it, people's mouths tend to open really wide... and also OOOh'd about is
Thomas Hull's Five Intersecting Tetrahedra - which IS a geometric object,
but I hope does not fall into your "cubes you can make from joining units"
category... it is made out of 30 identical units (3 units from a square),
that are very easy to make. The assembly is a bit tricky - but it is
absolutely worth it. People think it's made of wood...
the url for the diagrams: http://web.merrimack.edu/~thull/fit.html

And since you mentioned a Pegasus, I have, next to the skeleton, a Kawahata
Pegasus (from "Origami Fantasy") made out of extremely large Fadeless
paper. It's very nice, but tends to spread out...

Good luck
                Gilad

At 07:18 15/10/99 -0400, you wrote:

>I'd like to have an origami model standing somewhere in my room which would
>make people impressed and of course it would have to be one I had made. I'm
>thinking of maybe a Pegasus or a dinosaur skeleton if it's something special,
>other suggestions are more than welcome! I'd be happy if you would write
me if
>you have a suggestion and give me the URL to the diagram online or if
>necessary tell me which book it is in.
>I'd also like if someone knows a model that is made of several parts but each
>part is not too difficult to make and in the end you get a great result. I
>don't mean all those cubes you can make from joining units, but something
>different!
>Thanks in advance!
>                      Anine
>
>____________________________________________________________________
>Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1





From: Julius Kusserow <juku@MATHEMATIK.HU-BERLIN.DE>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 12:03
Subject: Re: Can you help me?

On Fri, 15 Oct 1999, Anine Cleve wrote:
...
> I'd also like if someone knows a model that is made of several parts but each
> part is not too difficult to make and in the end you get a great result. I
> don't mean all those cubes you can make from joining units, but something
> different!
Hi Anine,
I also don't like modular cubes and so on. But one I think a very
impressive Modular/Multipiece Origami, is the Arch from Maarten v. Gelder.
If you have the space and the time it's really impressive.
I have put it in my room and most of the persons enterd don't notice it
first, but then...           I like thes model very moch, really

ftp://ftp.rug.nl/origami/index.htm

Good luck
        Julius





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 12:38
Subject: Re: Can you help me?

Hi Anine!  What about folding one of those big modular horses that I saw a
picture of in Origami for the Conn.?

David





From: Doug and Anna Weathers <dougw@RDROP.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 13:39
Subject: Re: paper supplies

>In article <0.5810e40f.2537953c@aol.com>, Leigh Halford
><Leigh451@AOL.COM> writes
>>Does anybody know where I can get decent sized (30cm+) foil, rather than the
>>piddly little 15cm squares I can get at my local shop, in dear old England.
>>Before anybody suggests cutting it myself I am useless at cutting squares!!
>Buy a paper cutter( guillotine) you can get them in Office World or
>other stationery shops, then it doesn't matter about your cutting
>skills.
>>
>All the best
>
>penny
>

Before you buy a paper cutter, check a few things on it if you can.  Take a
large pieco of square paper or a T-square and check if the grid, paper wall
at the top, and cutting edge are square to each other.  Office purposes
seem to be less demanding than origami, and I have found most paper cutters
less square than I would like.  Some of them are adjustable to square.
Check for that.  Also, the more expensive guillotines, with heavier cutting
arms and stronger connections to the board, are more stable along the
length of the cut.  Some also prefer the rotary cutters, but I haven't had
a chance to try those.  Most of my cutting has been done on a fairly cheap
one at home or better ones "borrowed" at offices.

Anna

P. S.  There's quite a lot in the archives about cutting paper.  You might
find it useful to search them via Joseph Wu's site.  I had good luck with a
search which included the word cut and excluded the word fold.

Anna Weathers, Portland, Oregon, USA
"In paradox truth."





From: Doug and Anna Weathers <dougw@RDROP.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 13:39
Subject: Re: Amazing origami story

>Rob Hudson <FashFold@AOL.COM> sez
>
>>Lunch with Fuse?  I  can top that.
>>One time Akira Yoshizawa came to my house to use the bathroom.'
>
>Kids stuff - Dave Brill, Ted Norminton & myself made beautiful music
>together in my bedroom....
>
>all the best,
>
>Nick Robinson

What do you call yourselves?  The Rock Bottom Origami Remainders?

It really amazes me how often this list makes me laugh.  A definite
unexpected and highly pleasing bonus.

Of course, if my husband is listening, it often takes me quite a while to
explain the joke...  (Think back to that line " What are your top 10
favorite Origami Ungulates by Women whose Copyright have been violated as a
result of a conspiracy by OUSA Board Members???" from Michael Clark,
7/13/99.  I nearly fell off my seat, and he wanted to know why...)

Anna

Anna Weathers, Portland, Oregon, USA
"In paradox truth."





From: Doug and Anna Weathers <dougw@RDROP.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 13:39
Subject: Re: Can you help me?

>>I'd also like if someone knows a model that is made of several parts but each
>>part is not too difficult to make and in the end you get a great result. I
>>don't mean all those cubes you can make from joining units, but something
>>different!
>>Thanks in advance!
>>                      Anine

Many people seem quite taken with Fuse boxes.  Especially if I fold them
out of fabulous paper, like top quality foil wrapping paper in a solid and
a complimentary pattern I've cut myself, they will often bypass much more
complex folds and move right to the box.  They're easy and rewarding, and
if too many of them pile up, you can put small gifts in them and give them
away.  Entire bouquets of origami flowers seem to impress, too.  Since
there are so many different flower patterns out there, you can choose your
difficulty level.  James Sakoda's Origami Flowers has directions for
folding stems and leaves, and arranging flowers in a more Japanese style,
or you can just mass them in, Western style.  You can also use colored pipe
cleaners (chenille) for stems, or roll paper corner to corner and glue to
make straw-like stems (if you tolerate non-purity).  I've used various
manufactured and origami vases, and I'm eager to try some of the ones from
Oriland.  A dozen Kawasaki roses impresses, too.

Anna

Anna Weathers, Portland, Oregon, USA
"In paradox truth."





From: Joe Wezorek <joew@DYNAVOXSYS.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 14:16
Subject: paper suppliers on the web

Has anyone ordered paper
from http://www.artpaper.com ?
Is looks like they have a huge
selection, but I'd hate to
buy expensive paper without seeing
(and feeling) it first.

Joe





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 14:44
Subject: Re: Newcomer and Question

At 21:03 99/10/14 -0700, you wrote:
>I see your points (to both Joseph Wu and Robert J. Lang).  I was a little
>extreme but my point is if today you were going to choose what book to buy
>I would go with Origami Fantasy.  I blew everything a little out of
>proportion, I'm sorry.

Remember also that the person who asked for a recommendation said that their
level of folding wasn't very advanced. So which would be the better book...?

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 14:44
Subject: Re: 'Realistic'.

At 23:58 99/10/14 +0100, Paul Jackson wrote:
>The description of complex origami as 'realistic' has long puzzled me.
>Paper as a material and origami as a technique would seem to be about
>as poor a way to represent realism as it is possible to find.

...

>I'm not questionning the validity of complex, so-called 'realistic'
>origami as a creative/aesthetic challenge, but I would like to see the
>inappropriate use of the word 'realistic' forever banished as a
>description of complex work.

Sorry, Paul. I know that it wasn't a good choice of words, but it was the
easiest to use. Please pardon my laziness. You'll notice that I at least put
the word in quotation marks!

>I'm off to put my head in a bucket of ice...

Do remember to breathe every now and then! 8)

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Carol Martinson <carolm47@YAHOO.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 15:25
Subject: Re: Complex vs. Intermediate folders

There is another reason why the complex classes at
origami conventions are usually not full.  I can fold
many, but not all, complex models from diagrams, so
when I attended my first convention I thought I could
expand my skills a little more by taking a couple of
complex classes.

What a shock!  I found myself struggling on models I
knew I should be able to fold.  It is very different
to learn complex models without diagrams while sitting
in the back of a classroom filled with people.
Sometimes the teacher would tell one side of the class
the next step and forget about the other side.  It
takes very different skills to learn a model visually
when you cannot get close to the teacher or always
understand what they are saying..  I was so surprised
that I talked to several people about this problem,
and they all said that when they first attended
conventions they discovered the same thing.  I alos
have a friend that can walk into any class and come
out with a perfect model each time -- different
skills.

I also know from personal experience that it can be
draining to teach a complex model and be sure that
everyone comes out with a decent looking result, so if
the teacher is conscientous, they may choose to teach
something a little less challenging in order to be
sure everyone is successful.  I don't think you can
necessarily judge the number of comples folders at an
OUSA convention by the number of classes given and the
how full they are.

Carol Martinson

=====

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com





From: Kim Best <kim.best@M.CC.UTAH.EDU>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 18:20
Subject: Re: Amazing origami story

Rob Hudson wrote:
>
> Lunch with Fuse?  I  can top that.
>
> One time Akira Yoshizawa came to my house to use the bathroom.'

Well, I shared a cab to the airport with Eric Joisel.

--
Kim Best                            *******************************
                                    *          Origamist:         *
Rocky Mountain Cancer Data System   * Some one who thinks paper   *
420 Chipeta Way #120                * thin, means thick and bulky *
Salt Lake City, Utah  84108         *******************************





From: Kim Best <kim.best@M.CC.UTAH.EDU>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 18:43
Subject: Re: 'Realistic'.

Paul Jackson wrote:
>

> The description of complex origami as 'realistic' has long puzzled me.
> Paper as a material and origami as a technique would seem to be about
> as poor a way to represent realism as it is possible to find.
>

You might want to check out the paper airplane at:
http://www.mizushobai.freeserve.co.uk/aircraft.htm

for a model that comments on the idea of realism in origami or any other
art form for that matter.

Yes, origami can make a comment!

--
Kim Best                            *******************************
                                    *          Origamist:         *
Rocky Mountain Cancer Data System   * Some one who thinks paper   *
420 Chipeta Way #120                * thin, means thick and bulky *
Salt Lake City, Utah  84108         *******************************





From: Howard Portugal <howardpo@MICROSOFT.COM>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 19:36
Subject: Re: Complex vs. Intermediate folders

After my first convention or two, I also felt it would be a good idea to
"stretch" to a complex class. I was able to fold complex figures from
diagrams without problems, but as Carol states (below), it is indeed quite
different to learn a complex model from a teacher instead of a book. I ended
up producing models that I wasn't too satisfied with, and as a result, I
stopped taking the complex classes for several years. At this point I'll
take a complex class now and then, but I find that I'm much more inclined to
get a set of the diagrams and then complete the model at my leisure. In
addition, when folding from the diagrams I find that I have a better
understanding of the model as I can look ahead several steps and see what
I'm striving for rather than doing each step without knowledge of the
future.

Howard (recently certified Private Pilot) Portugal

> From: Carol Martinson [mailto:carolm47@YAHOO.COM]
>
> There is another reason why the complex classes at
> origami conventions are usually not full.  I can fold
> many, but not all, complex models from diagrams, so
> when I attended my first convention I thought I could
> expand my skills a little more by taking a couple of
> complex classes.
>
> What a shock!  I found myself struggling on models I
> knew I should be able to fold.  It is very different
> to learn complex models without diagrams while sitting
> in the back of a classroom filled with people.
> Sometimes the teacher would tell one side of the class
> the next step and forget about the other side.  It
> takes very different skills to learn a model visually
> when you cannot get close to the teacher or always
> understand what they are saying..  I was so surprised
> that I talked to several people about this problem,
> and they all said that when they first attended
> conventions they discovered the same thing.  I alos
> have a friend that can walk into any class and come
> out with a perfect model each time -- different
> skills.

>>> Snip <<<





From: Elaina Quackenbush <elaina_quackenbush@NETZERO.NET>
Date: 15 Oct 1999 20:22
Subject: Re: Paper Cutters was     Re: paper supplies

I use a rotary blade from an ofice supplier, by Fiskars, and although it is
off slightly for the righthanded folks out there, the other side is
perfectly square.  (Lucky for me being left handed I suppose).

It will set you back by about 50 bucks, but it was the one I found to be
moston par for the purpose.

El

__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html





From: Vincent & Veronique <osele@NETCOURRIER.COM>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 01:50
Subject: SEOF Mobile

Hello,

> The most beautiful display of 1000 cranes I have seen was at the 1998
> SEOF conference.  Instead of the usual strings of cranes, the display
> was a giant mobile.  Maybe someone from the Charlotte area may have a
> digitised picture of it.
> Terry Rioux

Thanks for info !
I had some pb with my mail so I missed the answers.

Is-it possible to someone to send me some url (no photo please)
with theses photos ?

Could you described the mobile ?

Origamicalement
Vincent

--
 _______  Osele Vincent (Toulouse/France) Membre du MFPP     _____
|       | osele@multimania.com                              /|    |
|       | liste: origami-fr@povlab.org                     /_|    |
|       | http://www.multimania.com/osele/origami.htm     |       |
|_______| -----------------> ORIGAMI -------------------> |_______|





From: Krystyna i Wojciech Burczyk <burczyk@MAIL.ZETOSA.COM.PL>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 02:45
Subject: Re: Can you help me?

Hello Anine

Anine Cleve wrote:
>
> I'd also like if someone knows a model that is made of several parts but each
> part is not too difficult to make and in the end you get a great result. I
> don't mean all those cubes you can make from joining units, but something
> different!

You can use most types of modules to build complex polyhedra, not only
cube.
Try this link for photos:
http://www1.zetosa.com.pl/~burczyk/index-en.html
http://www1.zetosa.com.pl/~burczyk/origami/galery4-en.htm

Krystyna and Wojtek





From: DLister891@AOL.COM
Date: 16 Oct 1999 05:28
Subject: Back from Greece, but not yet readjusted to modern life.

I have now returned home from holiday on the Greek island of Zakinthos, but
have scarcely got back into my old routine. It was scarcely a step back in
time to the dream world of Classical Greece, but we had a wonderful time in
the sun and among people who have still not yet forgotten how to live real
lives. The Greeks are curiously laid back and extremely tolerant and
friendly, but despite all their appearances they know how to work hard when
it is important. But I do envy them their sunshine! And Ouzo.

I did notice an Internet cafe in a side street at the small resort where we
were staying and even toyed with the idea of trying to download my Origami-L
postings, but couldn't remember my password. Anyway, I was on holiday.

I must say "Thank you" to all those who have written to me personally: I will
reply as soon as I can, but there are some business matters which I must
complete before I can concentrate on private things.

More than ever before, I found the sheer volume of postings in Origami-L
almost overwhelming. Nearly 450 messages (although his included a few
postings from other lists to which I subscribe.) Origami-L is now turning
into a major list. At the same time,  coming back to it fresh, I found it
contained some very interesting themes and very little trivial or Non-Origami
matter. My faith is restored! I should like to have contributed comments of
my own to some of the items, but the opportunity has now passed. and, as I
have said, I have to be very stern with myself until I can clear my decks. I
must lurk for a while.

Origamical greetings,

David Lister.





From: Dave Mitchell <davemitchell@MIZUSHOBAI.FREESERVE.CO.UK>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 07:22
Subject: The price of technical vrtuosity

Robert Lang wrote: .......

>Kawahata (by my reckoning, the designer of the most technically
sophisticated models in the
>world today

but .... unfortunately just about the ugliest too!

Dave Mitchell





From: Paul Jackson <Mpjackson@BTINTERNET.COM>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 09:26
Subject: Re: The price of technical vrtuosity

> >Kawahata (by my reckoning, the designer of the most technically
> sophisticated models in the
> >world today
>
> but .... unfortunately just about the ugliest too!

Spot on.  Thank goodness someone has had the courage to state the
truth!!  I want to see what the response is from those on Origami-L
who revere only those models with lots of sticky-out bits before
responding myself.  Let's hope it provokes a lively debate.

Paul





From: "JacAlArt ." <jacalart@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 10:00
Subject: Re: The price of technical vrtuosity

>>but .... unfortunately just about the ugliest too!
Mad 'cuz you just can't fold them? His models look wonderful --  when folded
well!

>From: Paul Jackson <Mpjackson@BTINTERNET.COM>
>Reply-To: Origami List <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
>To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: Re: The price of technical vrtuosity
>Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 14:23:42 +0100
>
> > >Kawahata (by my reckoning, the designer of the most technically
> > sophisticated models in the
> > >world today
> >
> > but .... unfortunately just about the ugliest too!
>
>Spot on.  Thank goodness someone has had the courage to state the
>truth!!  I want to see what the response is from those on Origami-L
>who revere only those models with lots of sticky-out bits before
>responding myself.  Let's hope it provokes a lively debate.
>
>Paul
>

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Gillian Wiseman <gilladian@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 10:55
Subject: Re: Paper Cutters was Re: paper supplies

I also have a fiskars rotary cutting board, and I love it. It will even cut
things like matt board, and mine seems to be perfectly square in both
directions!

Gillian

>From: Elaina Quackenbush <elaina_quackenbush@NETZERO.NET>
>Reply-To: Origami List <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
>To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: Re: Paper Cutters was     Re: paper supplies
>Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 19:12:16 -0500
>
>I use a rotary blade from an ofice supplier, by Fiskars, and although it is
>off slightly for the righthanded folks out there, the other side is
>perfectly square.  (Lucky for me being left handed I suppose).
>
>It will set you back by about 50 bucks, but it was the one I found to be
>moston par for the purpose.
>
>El
>
>__________________________________________
>NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
>Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
>http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
>

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Eric Andersen <ema@NETSPACE.ORG>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 11:19
Subject: demanding Web Site visitors

Hi all,
Is it just me, or are other origami Web site owners constantly bombarded
with requests for diagrams from certain books? I point them to the
hundreds of diagrams available on the Web, but for some reason this is
never good enough for them. I got two emails today insisting that I scan
in diagrams from four or five models from "Origami Fantasy", convert them
to pdf, and email them out to them, simply because the book is too
expensive to purchase. I try to explain that this would be illegal, not to
mention extremely unfair to the author, but they keep writing back! Often
they send me rude responses, claiming that I am selfish and mean!

So is it just me?

What can I do to keep these people from getting upset but yet not
inhibit their enthusiasm?

-Eric :-P
origami@paperfolding.com

/=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=\
\   Eric Andersen                                       /
/    Mathematics, Music             ~  ~ __o            \
\     and Origami                 ~  ~ _-\<'_           /
/      ema@netspace.org        ~    ~ (_)/ (_)          \
\=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=/
         *** http://www.paperfolding.com ***





From: Ronald Koh <ronkoh@SINGNET.COM.SG>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 12:40
Subject: Re: The price of technical vrtuosity

It would be nice if you gentlemen could explain the criteria upon which
your views are based. :o)

> Dave Mitchell wrote:

> > >Kawahata (by my reckoning, the designer of the most technically
> > sophisticated models in the
> > >world today
> >
> > but .... unfortunately just about the ugliest too!

Paul Jackson responded:
>
> Spot on.  Thank goodness someone has had the courage to state the
> truth!!  I want to see what the response is from those on Origami-L
> who revere only those models with lots of sticky-out bits before
> responding myself.  Let's hope it provokes a lively debate.
>
> Paul





From: Cindy Walker <cw@JPS.NET>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 12:49
Subject: Re: Can you help me?

Anine,

>I'd like to have an origami model standing somewhere in my room which would
>make people impressed

I recommend Thomas Hull's 5 Intersecting Tetrahedra.
http://chasm.merrimack.edu/~thull/fit.html

I just finished it.  It looks WONDERFUL and has already elicited oohs and
aahs from several people.  You wanted something standing, but origami models
look great suspended on thread from the ceiliing.  I've hung many creations
from Origami Sea Life in my bay window.  This floating aquarium is quite
well received.  The Five Intersecting Tetrahedra would look wonderful
suspended in air too.  That's the destiny that awaits mine.  Folding it is
quite handleable.  Here's how it went for me:

1st pyramid: easy
2nd pyramid: took some thought to get it placed correctly.
3rd pyramid: approaching the difficulty of a Lang insect.  My husband called
when I was working on this part.  I answered "What!"  He said he was looking
for his sweet warm wife.  I told him "She's not here!"
4th pyramid: Mysteriously easy
5th pyramid: Even easier.  It all makes sense by this point.

Well worth the effort.

Cindy





From: Nick Robinson <nick@CHEESYPEAS.DEMON.CO.UK>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 13:21
Subject: Re: Amazing origami story

Doug and Anna Weathers <dougw@RDROP.COM> sez

>What do you call yourselves?  The Rock Bottom Origami Remainders?

Actually, it was Frankie Valley & the Harbingers - sadly we only made
one live appearance (at a Birmingham BOS convention), although Sony are
trying to tempt us out of retirement.

all the best,

Nick Robinson

email           nick@cheesypeas.demon.co.uk
homepage        http://www.cheesypeas.demon.co.uk - now featuring soda syphons!
BOS homepage    http://www.rpmrecords.co.uk/bos/





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 13:57
Subject: Folding the Chestnut

Hi folks,

after three wonderful weeks in sunny Corsica, we have finally returned
to good old cold and foggy Switzerland.

I didn't do much paperfolding, but I did a bit of sand sculpting (Daddy!
Can you make a train? Daddy! Can you make a mermaid? etc.).

Sand is a very interesting medium, it has many restrictions, it is very
fragile, and it doesn't get a lot of respect- the public usually walked
right over my creations!

So I'll shake off the salt and sand, and get ready for some serious
origami...

Matthias





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 14:05
Subject: Re: demanding Web Site visitors

Eric Andersen wrote:
> never good enough for them. I got two emails today insisting that I scan
> in diagrams from four or five models from "Origami Fantasy", convert them
> to pdf, and email them out to them, simply because the book is too
> expensive to purchase. I try to explain that this would be illegal, not to
> mention extremely unfair to the author, but they keep writing back! Often
> they send me rude responses, claiming that I am selfish and mean!
>
> So is it just me?
You're not alone. I get the same, although not very often. Most requests
that I get are quite polite, unless they're from a Swiss person that
tries to write in English <g>.

A while ago we had these kind of messages in rec.arts.origami, too. Some
people just think we've got nothing else to do than solve their
problems. It's an attitude that is present in all newsgroups, and these
people are usually flamed into oblivion pretty quickly...

I usually explain my point of view once, and then simply ignore any
further requests by that same person, unless he/she gets more polite.
Works quite well for me.

> What can I do to keep these people from getting upset but yet not
> inhibit their enthusiasm?
I don't think it's your job to keep them enthusiastic, esp. when they're
so rude. People that are so demanding of others just don't want to do
the work themselves, so they're likely to lose their enthusiasm pretty
quick anyway.

Matthias 'been there, done that, got the mailfilter' Gutfeldt





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 14:32
Subject: Re: The price of technical virtuosity

Just about the ugliest?  What are you smoking?  His models are beautiful.
There would little point in folding them if they were ugly.  Why do you
think I spent so long trying to master Pegasus?  And it's not just my
opinion: When I folded Montroll's Pegasus the reaction was "neat" when I
showed them a few weeks later Kawahata's Pegasus I got "wow" and the oohs
and aahs it deserves.  Does that seem ugly to you?  Usually models are ugly
when not folded right.  Even though I bashed Prehistoric Origami I will
admit there are no folds in there that I would say are ugly.  The price for
complexity is not ugly models, it's sour fingers.

David





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 14:36
Subject: Re: demanding Web Site visitors

Hi Eric!  Just tell them you lost Origami Fantasy.  Or tell them you're so
smart you just memorized in the store and didn't bother buying it and you
suggest they do the same.  That ought to keep them at bay.  Or you could be
even more elaborate: tell them you just moved and all your books and your
scanner are packed in boxes in the garage.

David





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 14:38
Subject: [NO] Re: Folding the Chestnut

To people in cold Switzerland: nahnahnah!  It's still warm in the eighties
here in good old sunny central California.

David





From: Sebastian Marius Kirsch <skirsch@T-ONLINE.DE>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 15:40
Subject: Re: demanding Web Site visitors

On Sat, Oct 16, 1999 at 11:19:25AM -0400, Eric Andersen wrote:
> Is it just me, or are other origami Web site owners constantly bombarded
> with requests for diagrams from certain books?

All I can say is that I have the following paragraph on my web page:

--
    <p>Usually I mention from which book or booklet I got the
      diagrams. This is just to save me from being swamped with
      questions by people who absolutely <em>must</em> fold that
      model, but do not know where to find it. It is not, I repeat,
      <strong>not</strong> an invitation to pester me for photocopies
      from these books.
--

And so far, I have only received one very polite request for diagrams.

--
Yours, Sebastian <skirsch@t-online.de>

*** Dieses Schreiben wurde mit Hilfe einer Datenverarbeitungsanlage ***
*** erstellt und bedarf keiner Unterschrift.                        ***





From: Sebastian Marius Kirsch <skirsch@T-ONLINE.DE>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 17:40
Subject: Re: The price of technical vrtuosity

On Sat, Oct 16, 1999 at 02:23:42PM +0100, Paul Jackson wrote:
> > >Kawahata (by my reckoning, the designer of the most technically
> > >sophisticated models in the world today
> > but .... unfortunately just about the ugliest too!
> Thank goodness someone has had the courage to state the truth!!

Well ... what's truth anyway?

I must admit that I quite like some of Kawahata's creations; my
favourites are those that are designed around one central geometric (or
even quasi-tesselated) structure. His stegosaurus, his ankylosaurus and
his dimetrodon fall in this category. The last is a particular favourite
of mine: Those twist folds are one of the few possibilities to make an
"origami circle", and he uses it expertly to make a round sail for the
dimetrodon; the whole model revolves around that central twist fold.

The next remark may sound peculiar to those who know the aforementioned
models, but: They are, as regard their basic structure, quite
simple. They do not contain much "advanced geometry", in the sense of
Maekawa's Daemon, but instead, they are designed around one central
structure that generates enough excess paper for all the appendages to
be formed.

I must admit that generally, I am more interested in structures than in
shapes (I will have to make a gallery of my b/w photography some day so
you can all see what I mean.) But pure tesselations are often too
lifeless, meaningless -- and these Kawahata models are one way to
incorporate structure into living animals. (Other examples that I
enjoyed even more were Eric Joisel's phantastic models, in particular
his pangolin, his hedgehogs and his turtle, and Robert Lang's Red-Eared
Slider.)

I think that most origami animals are rather bland, because they capture
the basic shape of the depicted animal, but they fail to capture its
structure, the stuff that makes it interesting: the texture of its hide,
the structure of the feathers, the scales of a lizard skin ... The
folders has to make up these deficiencies with a proper choice of paper.

And, to take up my earlier point: Well ... what's beauty anyway?

I'm no artist, but these are my $0.02 worth.

--
Yours, Sebastian <skirsch@t-online.de>

*** Dieses Schreiben wurde mit Hilfe einer Datenverarbeitungsanlage ***
*** erstellt und bedarf keiner Unterschrift.                        ***





From: Gillian Wiseman <gilladian@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 18:22
Subject: Re: demanding Web Site visitors

Tell them that if you do that, it is just possible you could get arrested
for copyright violation - that it is a law that you are not willing to break
-  and that you have no control over it - they are being mean and selfish in
expecting you to violate the law for them!

Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, as the saying goes!

And don't worry about their enthusiasm - if they're not even willing to
shell out for books, how great is their interest?

Also, try posting a clear statement on your webpage on your views about
where diagrams that you post come from. That may reduce the number of
illicit requests you receive.

Gillian

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Dribalz@AOL.COM
Date: 16 Oct 1999 19:47
Subject: Tom Hull's Five intersecting tetrahedra

In reply to Cindy who was replying to Anine regarding a nice model to place
in the room to elicit oohs and aahs:

I agree with your assessment of the assembly of the pyramids as this model is
constructed.  For further aggravation try doing it with paper all the same
color.  I did mine with dollar bills and have nightmares just thinking about
the assembly of it.  BTW the model is shown on page 6 of the latest issue of
the PAPER (Fall '99).  At the convention (OUSA , NY '99) I saw someone else
who had done the model (if I remember correctly) out of silver foil paper.
I'm sure it was tough to assemble also.

Andrew Hans





From: Jeff Kerwood <jkerwood@USAOR.NET>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 20:18
Subject: Re: Tom Hull's Five intersecting tetrahedra [assemble]

Well, I've known about this model for a long time and guess I better just
buckle down and do it - it always looked interesting but everybody say's
assembly is such a puzzle. I have read what's with Tom Hull's page
diagrams. But I'm thinking that maybe some of you who have struggled with
the assembly (and won ;-) might have some specific words of advice
(insights) that would make it easier for us first timers. Just a little
narrative telling us what you figured out that allowed you to finally
succeed would be great.

Thanks to whoever takes the time to offer their wisdom :-).

Jeff Kerwood.





From: Jeff Kerwood <jkerwood@USAOR.NET>
Date: 16 Oct 1999 20:22
Subject: ( REPOST ) Cutting Squares (Re: Paper Cutters was (Re: paper supplies))

In article <0.5810e40f.2537953c@aol.com>, Leigh Halford
<Leigh451@AOL.COM> writes
>Does anybody know where I can get decent sized (30cm+) foil, rather than
> the
>piddly little 15cm squares I can get at my local shop, in dear old
> England.
>Before anybody suggests cutting it myself I am useless at cutting
> squares!!

I have two ways that I cut paper that I've not seen written about recently.
I thought I'd repost a two clips from the archives.

REPOST 1:

I have been making a bunch (12!!!!) Fuse quilts for next years Christmas
presents.  So, as you can imagine I have been cutting LOTS of paper and
getting very frustrated at how time consuming it was and how, despite
trying really hard, UNsquare my results were.  Templates worked ok but they
seemed cumbersome, having to make sure it doesn't slip and having to stand
over it and contort this way and that.  In a previous email I asked for
advice about this, many of you gave suggestions, thanks.  But, I have come
upon the ultimate solution.  A framers mat cutter.  It can easily and
quickly and ACCURATELY zip through 15 kami weight sheets of paper (I even
tried 30 and it worked fine).  The one I have will cut large paper but only
into pieces up to 4.5 inches (perhaps some contrivance could be devised to
extend that but I haven't gotten that figured out yet).  It is kind of
expensive (about $170) but it really works great.  Here is the info for the
one I have: Logan Mat Cutter Model #301-S from the ASW Express catalogue
(919-878-5077).  If you decide to try this, email me personally and I'll
pass on a few tips that I found came in handy.

REPOST 2:

How to cut a perfect (or very nearly so)
pentagonal piece of paper or create a pentagonal template.
[snip]

In MS Word97 (earlier versions have hexagons but not
pentagons) bring in a pentagonal "AutoShape" (hold the SHIFT key when you
are using  mouse to bring the shape into your doc (this will keep proper
proportions), once the pentagon is in your word doc you can keep proper
proportions by holding down the  SHIFT key when you grab a corner to
resize. There is an option (under Format Autoshape) that you can set to
always keep proper proportions. [snip]...
They print with a nice line around the boarder. I use an
exacto and metal ruler to cut just a hairs width inside this line and it
works great.

>From this point you have three options. You can print and cut out the
pentagon and fold it. You can use the printed pentagon as a
one-time-template by placing it over your  *good* paper then cutting both
out. Or, you can use the printed template as a one-time-template to create
a durable template on framers matboard (I have done this and it works) or
Plexiglas (I haven't tried this but its gotta work - right?).

I spent a lot of time trying different ways of doing this and this is the
only way I could get creasless perfect pentagons. You can of course do the
same thing with [squares,] hexagons,  triangles or whatever.

END OF REPOSTS

Hope this helps Leigh.
Jeff Kerwood
