




From: Kimberly Shuck <atsina@HOOKED.NET>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 11:08
Subject: Re: [NO] Borders is a skurj

Doug and Anna Weathers wrote:

> I grew up in a small town, too.  In fact, there were only 350 people there,
> and it was 45 miles to the nearest larger town (of 3000.)  I was probably
> poor, but since I didn't have big chains and malls waving huge amounts of
> things for me to buy (that I couldn't afford) at me, I didn't notice being
> poor.

Yeah. I grew up on an Indian reservation and in San Francisco. So I knew that we
were poor. There were about 350 people in my home town too. It was fantastic to
be a kid there. Sometimes we were hungry and it was still fantastic to be a kid
there. There were also no bookstores, but the school had a fantastic librarian.
I fill my house with books now, and am not particularly ashamed of the clutter.

I don't need my local bookstore to carry all of the origami books in existence.
Free reviews and pre reviews of said books arrive in my in box on my computer
daily, via the list. My local small bookstore orders things for me without me
having to pre pay. Since they are a small bookstore the folks who work there
know me and my tots and can tell me when something we might like comes out. I
have compared their prices to the larger places, and they are generally
identical. My reasons for preferring my local small store are social, not
romantic. Our local bookstore supports the local schools in ways that the chains
have not done (and we did ask them both). Artists from the area display artwork
at the bookstore, which the chains in the area also do not allow.

I am glad to hear through this thread that the giant stores please some people,
as they seem to be everywhere these days. But I am even happier that my local
bookstore is doing well.

Just another opinion,
Kim





From: Rachel Katz <mandrk@MAIL.PB.NET>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 14:00
Subject: Oriland is a semi-finalist!

"Travel to Oriland" Katrin and Yurii's origami entry in the ThinkQuest
competition has just been named a semi-finalist. If you haven't been on a
quest for The Lost Diagrams yet,  the URL is:
                        http.//library.advanced.org/27152/index.htm

Also, anyone who has ordered CD's or a book, mailings will be made from Russia
next week. I don't think Oribana is quite ready though.

I can accept orders on an ongoing basis from anyone who can get me a check or
money order to me in U.S. dollars. Please reply privately if you want more
information.

Rachel Katz
Origami - it's not just for squares!





From: Kelly Dunn <Kellydunn@AOL.COM>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 16:59
Subject: Re: 3000-year old books

In a message dated 9/26/99 1:51:10 PM, jupalffy@BLUEWIN.CH writes:

<< Who says 3000-year old books don't live on? >>

Thanks, but I was thinking more like hundreds of books written by single
individuals whose lives we could know through their writing.
Everyday...people, memoirs, and the history of the stories. A lot is lost,
but may not be to future generations. We at this point have to guess a lot
about the past ...3000 years ago. Relating this to origami, I wish that a
complete history of the traditional models was available. It is fascinating
to me that the art dates back to the invention of paper. Wouldn't a book of
myths and oral history be fascinating. But, the history seems lost and
jumbled.
Best wishes,
Kelly





From: Cathy <cathypl@GENERATION.NET>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 17:31
Subject: Re: [NO] libraries and e-books

At 08:15 AM 99-09-26 -0700, you wrote:
>I don't think e-books will replace print very soon.  Books are nicer to
>hold, and don't rely on changing technologies to remain readable.
>
>Anna

You can read them in bed, you can read them on the beach, you can read them
in the bathtub....

When you can't find a particular model that you know you have somewhere,
it's easy to flip thru a whole bunch of pages.

Books are friendly creatures, you can hug them and carry them around in
your arms.  Mind you, a warm furry dog is better, but a book comes close!

                        Cathy

******^^^^^*****^^^^^*****

Cathy Palmer-Lister
Ste. Julie, Quebec
Canada
cathypl@generation.net





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 18:03
Subject: Re: 3000-year old books

>In a message dated 9/26/99 1:51:10 PM, jupalffy@BLUEWIN.CH writes:
>
><< Who says 3000-year old books don't live on? >>
>
>Thanks, but I was thinking more like hundreds of books written by single
>individuals whose lives we could know through their writing.
>Everyday...people, memoirs, and the history of the stories. A lot is lost,
>but may not be to future generations. We at this point have to guess a lot
>about the past ...3000 years ago. Relating this to origami, I wish that a
>complete history of the traditional models was available. It is fascinating
>to me that the art dates back to the invention of paper. Wouldn't a book of
>myths and oral history be fascinating. But, the history seems lost and
>jumbled.
>Best wishes,
>Kelly

How fair is that comparing to a time without a printing press?  Most of the
knowledge that was lost was due to burning of libraries that were done on
purpose.  That's a measure of our attitude towards books evolves with time
not how they age with time.

David





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 18:11
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

I checked out the listing, get this:

there is a bid of $17.14 on the Complete Book of Origami

tell me what kind of stupid moron bids 17 +shipping and handling when the
book only costs 9.95 and is in print!  My copy of the book only cost 6.95.
Is this an example of complete stupidity at work here?

David





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 19:47
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

Sorry I shouldn't be so mean I retract what I said.

David





From: Pat Ellis <EllisPS@AOL.COM>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 22:09
Subject: Re: Teach origami

I teach Origami whenever possible.  Sometimes I am paid other times it is on
a volunteer basis and sometimes it's spur of the moment.

I facilitate 2 Origami clubs.  One club is at the middle school at which I
substitute teach.  The other club is at a local craft store.  For neither of
these am I paid.  I do it for the sheer joy of sharing the art.

Sometimes I am asked to come to a commercial day care or school where I am
paid for my time and services as any other guest artist would be.

Your knowledge, expertise and talent are valuable.  There is nothing wrong
with being compensated for your time.  I reserve asking for compensation for
only those organizations who function for profit.  If they make money, why
shouldn't I.

But, this is only one persons opinion.

Pat Ellis





From: Dorothy Engleman <FoldingCA@WEBTV.NET>
Date: 26 Sep 1999 22:52
Subject: Music To Fold By

I've put together a selection of ragtime, stride, swing, novelty, blues,
jazz, popular standards and old-time piano midis for your folding
pleasure:

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/Orchestra/8654/FoldingCA/

Dorothy





From: Robby/Laura <morassi@ZEN.IT>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 01:45
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

Alex,
At 02.19 26/9/1999 -0500, you wrote:
>I am in no way connected with the seller of this book, but I thought list
>readers would be interested if anyone is looking for "Viva Origami". A copy
>is up for bid on ebay.com at
>http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170469190

Not only this one! Other books are on auction in this category, including
Honda's "World of Origami", Yoshizawa's "Creative Origami" and more. Go to
this page:

http://listings.ebay.com/aw/listings/list/category1124/index.html

then make a restricted "Search" (Search only in Non-Fiction : Hobby, Crafts
) with keyword "Origami"......

Happy bidding !
Roberto





From: Kelly Dunn <Kellydunn@AOL.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 02:41
Subject: Re: 3000-year old books

In a message dated 9/27/99 1:03:03 AM, dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU writes:

<< How fair is that comparing to a time without a printing press?  Most of the
knowledge that was lost was due to burning of libraries that were done on
purpose.  That's a measure of our attitude towards books evolves with time
not how they age with time.
 >>

It was a comparison to what is possible in the future to preserve history,
not destroy it. Kelly





From: Gillian Wiseman <gilladian@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 06:31
Subject: Re: libraries and e-books

As a librarian, I just have to throw in my 2 cents here:
        1). Yes, donating your books to the library is very worthy. But be
     aware of
several things; they may never reach the library shelves because of policy
about donations, or failure to reach the correct staff members - ask in
detail first how to donate! also, Origami books have a bad habit of going
home with one person and never coming back. last - bindings on origami books
get torn up fast - they have to be forced flat open by the folder, thus
cracking and loosening pages. Do this to a book over and over, and its a
goner. If anybody bound Origami books in spiral binding or something.....

        2.) E-books are expensive, cumbersome, require more maintenance, are
"unfriendly" to a vast number of people, and will never be retrospective.
Don't expect "real paper" books to disappear in our lifetimes, I suspect.

Gillian

>From: Kelly Dunn <Kellydunn@AOL.COM>
>Reply-To: Origami List <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
>To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: libraries and e-books
>Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 04:21:41 EDT
>
>In a message dated 9/26/99 2:19:15 AM, dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU writes:
>
><< it's just
>absurd when you can use the library and used bookstores to get the same
>books.  I also don't understand people who want the book right now and
>don't want to wait a couple of days to order it or reserve it at the
>library.  >>
>
>Yes, I'm for libraries too, and donating money you may spend on books (or
>donating your books) to libraries, if you spent money on books, and are
>finished reading them. Then, your local library is better resource and
>making
>books and reading and origami available to more people. Not to be a
>minimalist, but books kind-of clutter the house up don't they. Not very
>peaceful.
>Also, soon with e-books, we are not going to need book stores. So, the
>chain
>stores are in trouble too. Not, now, but in the future, we are not going to
>need paper books. An e-book can hold a whole library to carry with you.
>See,
>Publish Magazine, Aug 1999. We really don't need paper anymore, except to
>fold it.
>Kelly
>p.s. David, I renamed this for you.

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Gillian Wiseman <gilladian@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 06:45
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

David,
You wouldn't believe the prices that some things go for on e-bay and other
auction sites. Camera stuff - which my husband buys and sells - goes
frequently for 10-20% higher than new purchase cost!!

Duhhhhhh!

Gillian

>From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
>Reply-To: Origami List <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
>To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay
>Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 18:11:36 -0700
>
>I checked out the listing, get this:
>
>there is a bid of $17.14 on the Complete Book of Origami
>
>tell me what kind of stupid moron bids 17 +shipping and handling when the
>book only costs 9.95 and is in print!  My copy of the book only cost 6.95.
>Is this an example of complete stupidity at work here?
>
>David

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Carlos Alberto Furuti <furuti@AHAND.UNICAMP.BR>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 08:19
Subject: Re: Triceratops [Was Re: dream origami]

>>From: Carlos Alberto Furuti <furuti@ahand.unicamp.br>

Corrections and amplifications:

>>2) Gabriel Alvarez's, nice complex model published in a BOS collection (I
>>have to check which);
London' 92
>>3) a complex model by a Japanese creator (KINOSHITA Go, if I'm not mistaken),
>>Origami Tanteidan 4th;
3rd, not 4th

>>5) Javier Capoblanco, OUSA Annual 99 (?), two-piece;
three-piece...

>>There's a two-piece intermediate T. by a Japanese creator in a NOA magazine,
>>must check the number and author's name at home; I don't know whether
NISHIKAWA Seiji, NOS Origami'234, Feb 95

>>Please don't confuse the different models with same name and author. There's
>>even a fourth T. by KAWAHATA in an ORU issue (photo only, no diagram, so
Sorry, the T. in ORU#5 is the same as O.Fantasy's; there's actually a
different KAWAHATA *stegosaurus* in that issue (quite good, for looks at least)

>>        Sincerely,
>>                Carlos
>>        furuti@ahand.unicamp.br www.ahand.unicamp.br/~furuti





From: Foldmaster@AOL.COM
Date: 27 Sep 1999 08:47
Subject: Silver Stars for the OUSA Holiday Tree Wanted!

Dear All,

It is that time of the year, and I am looking for a variety of silver stars
to decorate the annual OUSA Holiday Tree which is displayed at the American
Museum of Natural History.  The theme for the tree is "Stars, Stars & More
Stars".  The new planetarium is planned to open in January to the public and
so to feature stars seems appropriate.  Last year, the museum had their live
butterfly exhibit and so we featured butterflies on the tree.

Of course, the tree will also have a myriad of origami animals and other
items related to natural history.  Therefore, the stars should be silver ONLY
in order to make them a background to the animals - mixed colors will be
distracting.

Needed:  Silver foil stars!
Size:            4" to 7" is acceptable.
Material:       Silver Foil - plain or embossed design ok
Model types:    your choice (flat or 3D)
Needed by:      October 31, 1999

Please send your models in a sturdy box to:

June Sakamoto
9 Merrill Drive
Mahwah, NJ  07430

THANKS!!!





From: Scott Cramer <scram@LANDMARKNET.NET>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 09:37
Subject: [NO] [NO] libraries and e-books

Cathy offered:

>Books are friendly creatures, you can hug them and carry them around in
>your arms.  Mind you, a warm furry dog is better, but a book comes close!

    I am going to take this opportunity to refrain from making a gratuitous
joke about being 'dog-eared' . For those of you who did not delete this
message before reading it (some people just don't learn), no thanks are
necessary.

Scott





From: Alex Barber <barber@THE-VILLAGE.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 12:05
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

>>I am in no way connected with the seller of this book, but I thought list
>>readers would be interested if anyone is looking for "Viva Origami". A copy
>>is up for bid on ebay.com at
>>http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170469190
>
>I can't get my browser to show me the scanned cover that the seller claims
>is there.  It has been pointed out before that "Viva Origami" is the title
>of a series of books.  Is this indeed the one with the Demon on the cover?

It is the book with the demon on the cover that got re-diagrammed recently
in JOAS.

Alex
barber@the-village.com | http://www.the-village.com





From: Jeannine Mosely <j9@WORLD.STD.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 12:56
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

Alex Barber wrote:

>I am in no way connected with the seller of this book, but I thought list
>readers would be interested if anyone is looking for "Viva Origami". A copy
>is up for bid on ebay.com at
>http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170469190

I can't get my browser to show me the scanned cover that the seller claims
is there.  It has been pointed out before that "Viva Origami" is the title
of a series of books.  Is this indeed the one with the Demon on the cover?

        -- Jeannine Mosely





From: Kenny1414@AOL.COM
Date: 27 Sep 1999 13:16
Subject: Re: libraries and e-books

In a message dated 9/27/1999 9:34:26 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
gilladian@HOTMAIL.COM writes:

> If anybody bound Origami books in spiral binding or something.....

Interesting.

Samuel Randlett's "Flapping Bird", and the Annual Convention
Collections are either spiral- or comb-bound, I forget which.
I took the Flapping Bird in to a library many years ago, and
was advised that they would never buy any book in that
style of binding, because it wore out too fast. *sigh*

Aloha,
Kenneth





From: Jaroslav Jasinskiy <protoierey@CHAT.RU>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 16:00
Subject: Eric Joisel's Fantastic Models

Hi everyone!
Does anybody know, where can I find diagrams of fantastic Eric Joisel's models,
     besides a rat?

     Thanks.

     Sergey Yasinskiy





From: Allen Parry <parry@ESKIMO.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 13:13
Subject: [NO]Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay-->IT'S WAR !!!!

On Mon, 27 Sep 1999, Ariel wrote:

> As I write this email, I have bid twice and been outbid both times...and
> all within 60 seconds......someone was online at the same time...

I also bid on the book and thought that too.... but it was just too quick.

There is an option, a "Dutch bid" where e-bay will automatically raise
your bid (to a maximum dollar amount) should someone else make a competing
bid.  That is what is going on.

The prices being offered on e-bay makes it tempting either to 1) buy
origami books as an investment or 2) sell off my current collection and
make a bundle.

Allen Parry





From: Ariel <ariel@DATAPHONE.SE>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 21:48
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay-->IT'S WAR !!!!

As I write this email, I have bid twice and been outbid both times...and
all within 60 seconds......someone was online at the same time...

So far the book is being sold for 46 USS...and 4 days are yet open to new bids.

To those who had problems seeing the page ( because of frames or any other
reason) this is the book written by Maekawa, featuring the famous Devil
that everyone wants to fold. there is a lot of confusion because other
series of book also feature that name....but in this case this is the one
so hunted.

The book is a must to those interested in getting deeper into that design
technique consisting of first creating a base using mathematics and then
start from the base using more conventional origami techniques ( or
something like that). to my knowledge the book is not on reprint ( or at
least it was not last year, when I desperately looked for it and got
entangled into a lot of bitter disputes on the list because of usage of the
forbidden word "photocopy").

good luck to all... I wonder if it will pass the 100 dollars.....

4 days and counting down...

Cheers,

         Ariel

At 01:45 AM 9/27/99 +0200, you wrote:
>Alex,
>At 02.19 26/9/1999 -0500, you wrote:
> >I am in no way connected with the seller of this book, but I thought list
> >readers would be interested if anyone is looking for "Viva Origami". A copy
> >is up for bid on ebay.com at
> >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170469190
>
>Not only this one! Other books are on auction in this category, including
>Honda's "World of Origami", Yoshizawa's "Creative Origami" and more. Go to
>this page:
>
>http://listings.ebay.com/aw/listings/list/category1124/index.html
>
>then make a restricted "Search" (Search only in Non-Fiction : Hobby, Crafts
>) with keyword "Origami"......
>
>Happy bidding !
>Roberto





From: Renata Fontenelle <ren@NLINK.COM.BR>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 00:58
Subject: Re: A warning

David says:

>I've just received my paper and books from fascinating folds today, and
>though I am happy with the delivery time and all (4 weeks). I was levied a
>customs charge of 26.10. I just thought it would be a good idea to warn
>people in the UK that rip off Britain is in full force here.
>
>Fortunately I had the cash on me but normally I wouldn't have as I pay for
>everything by credit card. If I hadn't the parcel would have been winging
>it's way back to the USA.
>
>NOTE: This is in no way a criticism of fascinating folds I am very happy
with
>their service, but it's just a case that others need to know what the
charges
>will be in total as it's ended up being a rather expensive experience.

Hi David,

I can sympathize with you as this has also happened to me once. And right
you are to stress that this is no way a criticism of Fascinating Folds, for
this has nothing to do with them or their services. Customs charges are
taxes charged by your own country over certain imported products.

In my case, I had bought some paper (artisan, a full sheet and some origami
paper) and a couple of books and still I was charged 60% over the price of
my purchase (even the books, which are tax free here in Brazil). When I
tried to find out why, they told me it was because those things were not
*tax free*, they had categorized my paper as *wall paper*.

Anyway, in the end I managed to convinced some burocrats that the only
walls I could cover with that one sheet of paper would be those of a
dollhouse, so they gave me my money back.

So the warning should be really: before you order anything from abroad,
check first if those products are exempt of taxes in your country... That
way you don't run into any unexpected and (well, unpleasant) surprises like
we did.

Renata





From: Marion Riley <marion-r@WEBTV.NET>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 16:38
Subject: Origami books for sale on the net

    An alternative to e-bay for used origami books is www.bookfinder.com
put origami in extra keywords, set the field to return 200 hits per site
and punch search. This
will pull up everything on their lists origami
related. Look carefully, this is a list of many
different venders with sometimes wildly divergent prices. I find this
site helpful in establishing the value of some of my out of print
titles.

           Marion L. Riley lll





From: DLister891@AOL.COM
Date: 27 Sep 1999 17:30
Subject: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

I find this thread most interesting. Unfortunately I am at this moment
waiting for the taxi to take me to the airport, bound for Greece and I am
unable to contribute further to the discussion.

But I should be very grateful if someone would tell me just what is an
"e-book" and perhaps direct me to a  Web site that will give me more
information.

David Lister.





From: Howard Portugal <howardpo@MICROSOFT.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 17:43
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

Careful you don't get any sap on ya

> -----Original Message-----
> From: david whitbeck [mailto:dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU]
> Sent: Monday, September 27, 1999 5:44 PM
> To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books
>
>
> Cutting down all the trees?  Isn't that a bit harsh?  Life would be
> meaningless without trees, they're our friends!  Now Dave go
> out and give a
> tree a nice big hug and ask for forgiveness.
>
> David





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 17:43
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

Cutting down all the trees?  Isn't that a bit harsh?  Life would be
meaningless without trees, they're our friends!  Now Dave go out and give a
tree a nice big hug and ask for forgiveness.

David





From: Christopher Holt <Ella-mae@EMAIL.MSN.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 17:51
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

----- Original Message -----
From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>

> Cutting down all the trees?  Isn't that a bit harsh?  Life would be
> meaningless without trees, they're our friends!  Now Dave go out and give
a
> tree a nice big hug and ask for forgiveness.

Sort of like Reagan's assertion the trees cause most of the pollution on
Earth. Human's say the darndest things...

All the best - c!!!





From: "L. Hayashi" <lmh@COMPUSMART.AB.CA>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 17:57
Subject: 10 th Origami Festival - Edmonton

Hello,

I just received a News Release from the Consulate-General of Japan that talked
     about
Edmonton's Forthcoming Origami Festival.

If any of you are around the following places in Alberta you may be interested
     to know
that Ms. Tomoko Fuse and Mr. Fumiaki Kawahata will be in Alberta to
     demonstrated, display
and share their skills and talents.

Their first stop in the province will be at the Royal Tyrrell Museum in
     Drumheller after
which they will visit Edmonton.  While in Edmonton, they will participate in
     the 10th
Anniversary Origami Festival, co-sponsored by:  The Edmonton Art Gallery, the
     Friends of
Folding, Edmonton; and the Consulate General of Japan.  They will also be
     holding a
workshop at the University of Alberta.

Date:  Thursday, October 14, 1999 10 - 5 PM
Place:  The Royal Tyrell Museum, Drumheller, Alberta

Date:  Saturday, October 16, 1999 10 - 5 PM
           Sunday, October 17, 1999 12- 5 PM
Place:  The Edmonton Art Gallery,
            2 Sir Winston Churchill Sq..
            Edmonton

Date:  Monday. October 18, 1999   10 - 11:30
Place:  University of Alberta Room 115 Education North
        NOTE:  Pre registration is required for this session
        (780)  492-0747

Free Admission at the Edmonton Art Gallery and the University of Alberta





From: Dave Stephenson <EruditusD@AOL.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 19:28
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

I believe IBM has a e@book reader developed which is basically a piece of
paper saturated with tiny LED's (or something similar) so that people still
have the feel of reading a real book. This seems to be the most interesting
development I've seen so far.

I know this view is set to become very dated in the next 10 years but... I
like books and I doubt that scrolling the pages of an e@book will have the
same psychological impact or feel of a real book. Anyone agree?

Oh and by the way I just been reading through an old new scientist and I've
found an interesting article which comes to the conclusion that the trees are
not the lungs of the planet as certain groups claim. They put out as much
carbon dioxide as they absorb. As it's all released when they die and rot ...
in fact the article actually suggests that the best thing for the environment
would be to chop them down and turn them into paper as this traps the carbon
dioxide in permanently :) )

Dave (aka Eruditus)

***********************************
* Dave-S has left the building *





From: Dave Stephenson <EruditusD@AOL.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 19:58
Subject: A warning

I've just received my paper and books from fascinating folds today, and
though I am happy with the delivery time and all (4 weeks). I was levied a
customs charge of 26.10. I just thought it would be a good idea to warn
people in the UK that rip off Britain is in full force here.

Fortunately I had the cash on me but normally I wouldn't have as I pay for
everything by credit card. If I hadn't the parcel would have been winging
it's way back to the USA.

NOTE: This is in no way a criticism of fascinating folds I am very happy with
their service, but it's just a case that others need to know what the charges
will be in total as it's ended up being a rather expensive experience.

Dave-S

***********************************
* Dave-S has left the building *





From: James Storrs <italic@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 20:37
Subject: assertion

You think he said that because you've heard it said that he said that.
Please post here IN CONTEXT the comments you're referring to, in his exact
words.  Then we can discuss the matter and decide whether your
interpretation of what he is alleged to have stated is accurate.  Since you
brought up this silly thing up, the burden is upon you to back up what you
assert.
James Storrs

> Sort of like Reagan's assertion the trees cause most of the pollution on
> Earth.





From: Kelly Dunn <Kellydunn@AOL.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 22:17
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

In a message dated 9/28/99 12:41:54 AM, dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU writes:

<< Cutting down all the trees?  Isn't that a bit harsh?  Life would be
meaningless without trees, they're our friends!  Now Dave go out and give a
tree a nice big hug and ask for forgiveness. >>

So, books, and trees are our friends, and origami paper too. What a better
day than sitting under a tree with an origami book and origami paper! And,
giving the tree a big hug when you get a model. Kelly





From: "James M. Sakoda" <James_Sakoda@BROWN.EDU>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 22:22
Subject: Re: over 80

>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: Daniela Carboni <rednina@TISCALINET.IT>
>>To: <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
>>
>>> Thoki Yenn wrote:
>>>
>>> >Am I the only one over 80
>>>
>>>
>
>I guess that just means that you're one of the few over 80 that's up with
>today's technology that also folds origami!  Impressive, most impressive.
>When I'm that old I would only hope to be is upbeat as you.
>
>David
Age does not have to prevent active folding.  I was recently in a hospital
for a checkup  and was told by a nurse how soft my skin was and she could
not believe that I was 83  I think that Akira Yoshizwa is five years older
than I am.
James M. Sakoda





From: Rob Hudson <FashFold@AOL.COM>
Date: 27 Sep 1999 23:41
Subject: Re: over 80

Wow!

Dr. Sakoda,

What's your secret?  83 years old and still a hit with the chicks!   I am not
worthy....

Rob





From: Christopher Holt <Ella-mae@EMAIL.MSN.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 00:23
Subject: Re: assertion

----- Original Message -----
From: James Storrs <italic@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>

> You think he said that because you've heard it said that he said that.
> Please post here IN CONTEXT the comments you're referring to, in his exact
> words
>
> > Sort of like Reagan's assertion the trees cause most of the pollution on
> > Earth.

I feel no need to go off and find an old speech that I heard at the time of
its utterance (dumbfoundedly), however, in a speech in 1981 he was quoted as
having said that 80% of air pollution on the planet was due to trees, as
well as asserting that trees cause more pollution that automobiles, either
one being a patently false declaration. This was when James Watt was
secretary of the interior, stripped the epa of its regulatory powers, and
was selling Federal land like Crazy Eddie to any corporate interest that was
willing to rape it. If you wish to have the exact words, go look for them, I
have to look no farther than his policies to correctly analyse his intent.





From: Valerie Vann <valerie_vann@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 02:57
Subject: Ebay auctions

Ariel wrote:
<<As I write this email, I have bid twice and been outbid both times...and
all within 60 seconds......someone was online at the same time...

Someone doesn't necessarily have to be online to beat your bid
within 60 seconds. It is more likely someone who is using the
automatic bidding feature. You set your maximum bid and if every
time someone else places a bid lower than your maximum, the autobidder
ups your bid by the minimum amount. Their maximum will take precedence
over any lower or equivalent bid right down to the end of bidding,
so you can find yourself being outbid in the last seconds of the
auction by someone who established a slightly higher maximum in the
early days of the auction.

Valerie Vann





From: Debra Nelson <debnels@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 06:35
Subject: Deadlines for The Paper

Just a reminder--the deadline for the Winter issue of The Paper is
October 15. If you have any member news or articles, please email them
to me by then. The main feature will be on Origami by Children, but
other features are welcome as well.
Thanks.
Debra Nelson-Hogan





From: Kimberly Shuck <atsina@HOOKED.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 08:17
Subject: a question (which I hope is origami related)

Hello all,
More and more often of late I have noticed people going after each other on the
list about what is and is not appropriate for discussion here. More astonishing
to me are the abusive off list replies that some have received, also to tell
them that they should not say anything unrelated to origami. I am curious about
the criteria here. Paper seems related to origami, as does the availability of
bookstores that carry origami books. I dare say that it is really not
appropriate to post threatening off list responses. In fact, I think it actually
breaks the trust relationship that such a list is based on when your e-mail
address is suddenly used for harassment by people who don't agree with your
comments. So don't agree, but don't be abusive.

The question is, what do people think the scope of discussion be on the list
should be? Seems that announcements regarding origami events, book commentary
and questions about specific folds and where to find them should be ok (although
sometimes there are irritable reactions to questions that have already been
asked). I tend to take the position philosophically that most topics are
interrelated, but there are clearly differing philosophies on this list. So give
me some guidance here. And try to keep the responses on the list if this annoys
you because I think that there are a few people who would be curious as to why
you are annoyed.

Thanks for everyone's help,
Kim





From: James Storrs <italic@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 08:31
Subject: NO:    Ignorance

From: Christopher Holt:

> I feel no need to go off and find an old speech that I heard at the time
of
> its utterance (dumbfoundedly), however, in a speech in 1981 he was quoted
as
> having said that 80% of air pollution on the planet was due to trees, as
> well as asserting that trees cause more pollution that automobiles, either
> one being a patently false declaration. This was when James Watt was
> secretary of the interior, stripped the epa of its regulatory powers, and
> was selling Federal land like Crazy Eddie to any corporate interest that
was
> willing to rape it. If you wish to have the exact words, go look for them,
I
> have to look no farther than his policies to correctly analyse his intent.
=====================
So out of intellectual (I use that term loosely) laziness, you arrogantly
claim to be able to "correctly analyze...intent" from fuzzy memories of part
of a speech you may have heard but will not produce.  In fact, what you are
relying upon for your absurd conclusions and opinions is the wacko leftist
propaganda machine which spoon feeds you what to believe.
As Rob pointed out, you were out of line to insert your political attack on
an ORIGAMI list.  I responded only because fair-minded people often let such
insidiousness pass, but I chose not to.
This is my last message on this topic.





From: Rob Hudson <FashFold@AOL.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 08:37
Subject: Re: assertion

Well, Chris,

I strongly suggest that you make no further political criticism that is not
origami related.  Not everyone on the list is anti-conservative.  You don't
want to start this thread.. trust me..

ROb





From: DonnaJowal@AOL.COM
Date: 28 Sep 1999 08:52
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

This thread reminds me of the predictions of the "paperless office".  Anyone
remember that?  In the days when it was predicted a proposal was a letter,
one or maybe two pages long.  If you made a mistake you erased it and typed
over it.  So it took one or two pieces of typing paper.  Now a proposal, at
least in my field, is at least an inch thick and is reprinted at least 3
times, more likely 5, before it is as close as one can get to perfect with a
tight deadline.

So really it's more like a treeless world than a paperless office.  Surely
some totally unpredicted waste will also come about with e-books.

Always the optimist,
Donna





From: Jeff Kerwood <jkerwood@USAOR.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 08:56
Subject: Re: A warning

Renata,

> I can sympathize with you as this has also happened to me once.
> [snip
> Anyway, in the end I managed to convinced some burocrats that the only
> walls I could cover with that one sheet of paper would be those of a
> dollhouse, so they gave me my money back.

I had a friend that this same thing happened to (though I never heard her
outcome). I'm glad it worked out for you, I'll pass this information on to
her. Thank you for your thoughtful advice.

Jeff Kerwood





From: Howard Portugal <howardpo@MICROSOFT.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 09:43
Subject: Re: a question (which I hope is origami related)

Perhaps an expansion of the letter that Maarten sends out periodically would
be enough.

Howard

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rob Hudson [mailto:FashFold@AOL.COM]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 9:36 AM
> To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject: Re: a question (which I hope is origami related)
>
>
> In line with this post, would it be appropriate to post a FAQ
> once a month?
> At some point in the past there was one circulating around
> Perhaps people
> would be willing to contribute to a new-and-improved origami
> faq, including
> questions people ALWAYS ask on the list?
>
> Note: I think a separate copyright faq would be in order ;)
>
> I'd be wlling to help compile it.
>
> Rob





From: "Jonathan J. Picker" <Verdigris@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 10:35
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

At 07:28 PM 9/27/1999 EDT, Dave Stephenson wrote:
>Oh and by the way I just been reading through an old new scientist and I've
>found an interesting article which comes to the conclusion that the trees are
>not the lungs of the planet as certain groups claim. They put out as much
>carbon dioxide as they absorb. As it's all released when they die and rot ...
>in fact the article actually suggests that the best thing for the environment
>would be to chop them down and turn them into paper as this traps the carbon
>dioxide in permanently :) )

And the Deep Thinker award goes to the author of that article.  Not only
has that individual figured out a way to reduced carbon dioxide in the
environment, but as a bonus we'll be rid of countless birds, butterflies,
and thousands upon thousands of other species as well.  Well, at least we
would all have pretty sheets of paper to look at, not fold, since there
would be a lot less model ideas to be found in nature. . . .

Please forgive the sarcasm.  I'm in a bit of a mood today.

Jonathan

********************************************************
Jonathan J. Picker
Verdigris@earthlink.net

". . . And miles to go before I sleep . . ." --Robert Frost,
from his poem, "Stopping By Woods On A Snowy Evening".





From: "Chamberlain, Clare" <Clare.Chamberlain@HEALTH.WA.GOV.AU>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 10:47
Subject: Re: lizard with toes

Just to be pedantic, we have at least one lizard here with no toes or legs -
Yes, it's called the legless lizard, and it resembles a snake, except for
four tiny spurs where legs used to be.  Another interesting chap is the
thorny devil, who is spiky so that the dew forms overnight and dribbles into
its mouth - the male of this species has two penises (according to a
national science show), for those who want to fold really accurate models
and love a challenge!!

Clare, the great and sometimes glorious folder of the South  ;-)





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 10:58
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

At 18:11 99/09/26 -0700, David Whitbeck wrote:
>I checked out the listing, get this:
>
>there is a bid of $17.14 on the Complete Book of Origami
>
>tell me what kind of stupid moron bids 17 +shipping and handling when the
>book only costs 9.95 and is in print!  My copy of the book only cost 6.95.
>Is this an example of complete stupidity at work here?

Not necessarily stupid. Do we have any idea which edition this book is? The
very first edition had actual folded models in it and is virtually
impossible to find now. $17.14 would be CHEAP for that edition.

At 19:47 99/09/26 -0700, David Whitbeck wrote:
>Sorry I shouldn't be so mean I retract what I said.

Too late! You've been "permanently" recorded on the Internet! 8)

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: "Brannon, Dennis" <Dennis.Brannon@COMPAQ.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 11:32
Subject: LOG meeting notice Sept. 28, 7-9pm. [Littleton, MA USA]

The Littleton Origami Group (LOG) [Littleton, MA USA]
will be meeting the last Tuesday of the month (tonight) at the Littleton
library in the "Small Meeting" room downstairs next to the elevator.

Agenda:
Concord Library tree decorating project - Joyce
First Night project planning - Joyce
Traditional Chinese unit modulars - Dennis
Sharing and folding.

When: Tuesday,  August 31, 1999, 7:00 - 9:00pm.
Where: Reuben Hoar Public Library, Shattuck Street, Littleton, MA
Telephone: (978) 486-4046.

Directions:  Get to the junction of routes 2A/110, 119 and 495.
This intersection is in the center of town at the only traffic light.
There's a Mobile station and Bob's Solid Oak nearby.

1. Coming from 2A East take a left at the lights onto King Street (110/2A
West) toward Ayer, MA.
Coming from 119 West take a right at the lights onto King Street toward
Ayer, MA.

2. You'll pass Bob's Solid Oak and a Shell station on the right, then a
cemetery.  At 2 tenths of a mile from the light is a right hand fork -- this
is one entrance to Shattuck Street.

If you miss it, continue on 110/2A for 5 tenths of a mile.  The other
entrance to Shattuck Street is on the right opposite Badger Funeral home.
The sign says Town Offices.

There is free parking to the left and rear of the building.





From: "Brannon, Dennis" <Dennis.Brannon@COMPAQ.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 11:34
Subject: [date corrected]  LOG meeting notice Sept. 28, 7-9pm. [Littleton,

The Littleton Origami Group (LOG) [Littleton, MA USA]
will be meeting the last Tuesday of the month (tonight) at the Littleton
library in the "Small Meeting" room downstairs next to the elevator.

Agenda:
Concord Library tree decorating project - Joyce
First Night project planning - Joyce
Traditional Chinese unit modulars - Dennis
Sharing and folding.

When: Tuesday,  Sept. 28, 1999, 7:00 - 9:00pm.
Where: Reuben Hoar Public Library, Shattuck Street, Littleton, MA
Telephone: (978) 486-4046.

Directions:  Get to the junction of routes 2A/110, 119 and 495.
This intersection is in the center of town at the only traffic light.
There's a Mobile station and Bob's Solid Oak nearby.

1. Coming from 2A East take a left at the lights onto King Street (110/2A
West) toward Ayer, MA.
Coming from 119 West take a right at the lights onto King Street toward
Ayer, MA.

2. You'll pass Bob's Solid Oak and a Shell station on the right, then a
cemetery.  At 2 tenths of a mile from the light is a right hand fork -- this
is one entrance to Shattuck Street.

If you miss it, continue on 110/2A for 5 tenths of a mile.  The other
entrance to Shattuck Street is on the right opposite Badger Funeral home.
The sign says Town Offices.

There is free parking to the left and rear of the building.





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 11:45
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

>Not necessarily stupid. Do we have any idea which edition this book is? The
>very first edition had actual folded models in it and is virtually
>impossible to find now. $17.14 would be CHEAP for that edition.
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------
>Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
>t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
>w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca

You mean the photos in the book are no longer in there!?  Well I'm happy to
have a copy with the photos for 6.95, yippee!  Why would they take out the
photos and increase the price to 9.95?  Arghh!

David





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 11:48
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

At 11:45 99/09/28 -0700, you wrote:
>You mean the photos in the book are no longer in there!?  Well I'm happy to
>have a copy with the photos for 6.95, yippee!  Why would they take out the
>photos and increase the price to 9.95?  Arghh!

Methinks you misunderstood me. The ORIGINAL edition of the book, published
way back when (probably before you or I were born), is now a collector's
item because it contained actual folded models in addition to the diagrams
for those models. I don't know if it had photos or not, never having seen
that edition. Imagine the amount of work it would take to produced each copy
of that edition, add to it the fact that it is almost impossible to find
now, and you have an extremely expensive book.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 12:15
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

At 15:13 99/09/28 -0400, Scott Cramer wrote:
>Joseph Wu wrote:
>
>>Methinks you misunderstood me. The ORIGINAL edition of the book, published
>>way back when (probably before you or I were born)
>
>    I'm bethinkin' I'm totally confused. Either both David and Joseph are
>ten years old or less, or one of you is talking about some other Complete
>Book of Origami- not Robert J. Lang's, which is the one up on the auction
>block, yes? If THAT book came with folded models in it (stellated cubocta,
>cuckoo clock), it certainly would be a collectors item!

Eep! Blush! Silly me. I totally misread the title. For some reason, I
thought we were talking about HONDA Isao's "The World of Origami". Pardon me
while I go hide in shame... ;)

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Howard Portugal <howardpo@MICROSOFT.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 12:24
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

Marriage tends to scramble the brain Joseph, be on the lookout for other
symptoms as well ...

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joseph Wu [mailto:josephwu@ULTRANET.CA]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 12:16 PM
> To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay
>
>
> At 15:13 99/09/28 -0400, Scott Cramer wrote:
> >Joseph Wu wrote:
> >
> >>Methinks you misunderstood me. The ORIGINAL edition of the
> book, published
> >>way back when (probably before you or I were born)
> >
> >    I'm bethinkin' I'm totally confused. Either both David
> and Joseph are
> >ten years old or less, or one of you is talking about some
> other Complete
> >Book of Origami- not Robert J. Lang's, which is the one up
> on the auction
> >block, yes? If THAT book came with folded models in it
> (stellated cubocta,
> >cuckoo clock), it certainly would be a collectors item!
>
> Eep! Blush! Silly me. I totally misread the title. For some reason, I
> thought we were talking about HONDA Isao's "The World of
> Origami". Pardon me
> while I go hide in shame... ;)
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
> t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
> w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Papa Joe <papajoe@CHORUS.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 12:35
Subject: $ bill Butterfly

I have finished diagraming the model.

If anyone would like a copy just e-mail me.

Would any web masters like these instructions on there site?

The instructions are in the form of 3 jpg pictures.

Size...  pict 1 184kb
            pict 2 151kb
            pict 3 177kb

Format is 800 x 600

Thanks & happy folding.  Joe Gilardi

papajoe@chorus.net





From: Rob Hudson <FashFold@AOL.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 12:36
Subject: Re: a question (which I hope is origami related)

In line with this post, would it be appropriate to post a FAQ once a month?
At some point in the past there was one circulating around Perhaps people
would be willing to contribute to a new-and-improved origami faq, including
questions people ALWAYS ask on the list?

Note: I think a separate copyright faq would be in order ;)

I'd be wlling to help compile it.

Rob





From: BTStern <btstern@BUFFNET.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 14:16
Subject: 1000 Cranes

Hello to all...

I'm so excited I had to pass this on to all of you...

We just returned from a trip to SF....and I had decided to try folding the
1000 cranes while on the road....(I'm not allowed to drive on freeways
anymore...per my husband)

Anyway...I got them all done...and had 2 days of the return trip to
spare...I can't wait to get them strung...

to anyone who has made the 1000 cranes...what kind of paper did you use for
the main crane?.....and is there a lot of pull on it from the strung
cranes?...did you use any reinforcement on the main crane inside to prevent
it from tearing?  And for which occasions would the 1000 cranes be
appropriate as a gift?

Beth

http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Coffeehouse/9109/index.html
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Coffeehouse/9109/origami.html
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Coffeehouse/9109/Renaldo.html





From: Scott Cramer <scram@LANDMARKNET.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 15:13
Subject: Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay

Joseph Wu wrote:

>Methinks you misunderstood me. The ORIGINAL edition of the book, published
>way back when (probably before you or I were born)

    I'm bethinkin' I'm totally confused. Either both David and Joseph are
ten years old or less, or one of you is talking about some other Complete
Book of Origami- not Robert J. Lang's, which is the one up on the auction
block, yes? If THAT book came with folded models in it (stellated cubocta,
cuckoo clock), it certainly would be a collectors item!

Scott scram@landmarknet.net
Littleton, NH USA





From: Maarten van Gelder <VGelder@KVI.nl>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 15:33
Subject: Re: $ bill Butterfly

Papa Joe wrote:
>
> I have finished diagraming the model.
>
> If anyone would like a copy just e-mail me.
>
> Would any web masters like these instructions on there site?
>
> The instructions are in the form of 3 jpg pictures.
>
> Size...  pict 1 184kb
>             pict 2 151kb
>             pict 3 177kb
>
> Format is 800 x 600
>
> Thanks & happy folding.  Joe Gilardi
>
> papajoe@chorus.net

You may send them to me. Then I'll put them in the archives.

--
Maarten van Gelder    KVI - Groningen, Netherlands    vgelder@kvi.nl





From: Dave Stephenson <EruditusD@AOL.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 16:13
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

In a message dated 28/09/99 03:20:09 GMT Daylight Time, Kellydunn@AOL.COM
writes:

> << Cutting down all the trees?  Isn't that a bit harsh?  Life would be
>  meaningless without trees, they're our friends!  Now Dave go out and give a
>  tree a nice big hug and ask for forgiveness. >>
>
>  So, books, and trees are our friends, and origami paper too. What a better
>  day than sitting under a tree with an origami book and origami paper! And,
>  giving the tree a big hug when you get a model. Kelly
>

Isn't that just a little bit like spending a day in the countryside so you
can eat a hamburger next to the cows? Hey You could bring a chainsaw ... that
might give the tree a little insight into your true intent... I wonder how
many cranes you could make out of one of those really big one's:))

Dave

***********************************
* Dave-S has left the building *





From: "James M. Sakoda" <James_Sakoda@BROWN.EDU>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 16:15
Subject: Re: over 80

>Wow!
>
>Dr. Sakoda,
>
>What's your secret?  83 years old and still a hit with the chicks!   I am not
>worthy....
>
>
>Rob

Dear Rob, Thanks for the compliment.  I work in our flower and vegtable
garden a lot and I also take care of the lawn.  The work is not strenuous,
but provides good exercise and rewards of beautiful flowers and tasty
vegetables.  This year we had an abundance of cucumbers and I made
delicious kosher pickles. When I go out to work I always wear long sleeve
shirts and wear a straw hat  to protect my skin.  It may help that I don't
smoke or drink.  After a bath I iusually put lotion on my face and arms,
which may account for the soft skin.  More power to you.  James M. akoda





From: david whitbeck <dmwhitbeck@UCDAVIS.EDU>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 16:32
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: libraries and e-books

>
>Isn't that just a little bit like spending a day in the countryside so you
>can eat a hamburger next to the cows? Hey You could bring a chainsaw ... that
>might give the tree a little insight into your true intent... I wonder how
>many cranes you could make out of one of those really big one's:))
>
>Dave
>
>***********************************
>* Dave-S has left the building *
>***********************************

Old Man Willow will get you, you can run but you can't hide

You might just walk right into his forest or maybe you'll walk right into
an ent

David
ps for those confused, read Lord of the Rings.





From: The Kwaks <kwak@MEDIAONE.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 16:42
Subject: Re: $ bill Butterfly

I would like the diagrams for the dollar bill butterfly.
Thank you





From: Doug Philips <dwp@TRANSARC.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 17:37
Subject: Re: a question (which I hope is origami related)

Rob "IMAFOLDER" Hudson, indited:
+In line with this post, would it be appropriate to post a FAQ once a month?
+At some point in the past there was one circulating around Perhaps people
+would be willing to contribute to a new-and-improved origami faq, including
+questions people ALWAYS ask on the list?

+Note: I think a separate copyright faq would be in order ;)

Probably. ;-)

+I'd be wlling to help compile it.

Before the convention I started one and sent it to Joseph for consideration.
He circulated it to a few other folks. The one thing I haven't yet found is a
good URL to a "Netiquette" web page (esp. one available via e-mail for list
readers who are email-web-access only).

I'd be willing to revive that as a starting point.

-D'gou





From: Gillian Wiseman <gilladian@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 17:37
Subject: Re: libraries and e-books

Interesting! I suppose that it has to do with the fact that bindings have
gotten SO CHEAP and BAD in the last ten years or so that anything is better
than the current horrid stuff!!!!

Spiral binding or the other flat-type bindings are not preferable to good
solid stitched bindings and cloth covers, but are certainly nicer than glued
paper.

Gillian

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From: Dorothy Engleman <FoldingCA@WEBTV.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 17:46
Subject: Internet Auction Search Tool

For those who participate in on-line auctions, you may find this search
engine useful.  It will search multiple auction sites simultaneously:

http://dbmeta.auctionwatch.com/meta/

I just did a search for "origami" and received 54 results.

Dorothy





From: Dorothy Engleman <FoldingCA@WEBTV.NET>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 17:54
Subject: Re: Internet Auction Search Tool

The origami deities are indeed generous.   I just did a power search for
"origami" and received 65 responses.

Dorothy





From: Robby/Laura <morassi@ZEN.IT>
Date: 28 Sep 1999 18:40
Subject: Re: [NO]Re: "Viva Origami" on eBay-->IT'S WAR !!!!

Allen,
At 13.13 27/9/1999 -0700, you wrote:

>There is an option, a "Dutch bid" where e-bay will automatically raise
>your bid (to a maximum dollar amount) should someone else make a competing
>bid.  That is what is going on.

This is not an option..... just the way e-Bay works ! "Dutch bids" are a
different thing (selling several identical items as a unique lot).
>
>The prices being offered on e-bay makes it tempting either to 1) buy
>origami books as an investment or 2) sell off my current collection and
>make a bundle.

E-bay is great stuff...... believe me !

Roberto (eBayer veteran)
