




From: Christopher Holt <Ella-mae@EMAIL.MSN.COM>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 17:39:48 -0700
Subject: Re: mathematics will fail?

>I thought it was
> the purpose of science, not mathematics to describe the universe.
> Certainly mathematics is a tool to that purpose, but not as merely a means
> to an end.
>
> David

Thank you for that side of the coin. I agree wholeheartedly that the purpose
of science is to describe the universe, and mathematics is its lexicon. I
merely wanted to point out that science often sees itself, or the
mathematical models that it constructs, as the be-all and end-all way to
explain the universe. I consider myself a scientist, having been educated in
the sciences, and having been exposed most of my life to scientists. It is
the inablity of science to marry the innately artistic facility of
inspiration with analysis that has begun to disturb me. While in the past,
vision was inextricably tied to the pursuit of science, yet in this century,
science has become glorified engineering, (no offense to the engineers out
there, but you know that your functions as engineers are not tied to
creating a greater understanding of the universe's fundamental essence).
While science used to sleep with philosophy, it seems to be better
bedfellows with technology now. Mathematics is getting dragged along for the
ride like an unwilling dog. In fact, mathematics has begun to change all
that, as it becomes more apparent that the universe (in fact, any suitably
complex system) is going to approach an order more readily understood
through complexity, fractal geometry and choas than merely a strict pursuit
of physics, chemistry or biology. But as merely an accessory study to the
sciences, pure math has the appearance of being somewhat corrupted when used
for rigorous analysis, while as a generalized overview of systems it is
sublime. In short--the purposes of science and math have become reversed.
Math should be about the grand scheme, and each science should be the
translator through which that grand scheme is interpolated toward a better
understanding of physical phenomena. Phew!! Didn't mean to go on that long,
sorry. All the best-c
p.s.---this does have to do with origami, somehow...





From: Jim Alexander <jalex@MIDMAINE.COM>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 17:52:15 -0400
Subject: Re: Ant and Lobster

HI David,
        Try the lobster in Montroll's Animal Origami For The Enthusiast.
It's a masterpiece! His American Lobster doesn't work very well,the tail is
hopeless,and the model wouldn't even fool a tourist here in Maine!
Best Wishes, Jim Alexander





From: John Sutter <sutterj@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 17:56:57 -0700
Subject: Re: SIDECAP (Urgent)

At 02:52 PM 7/5/99 -0400, you wrote:
>-------------Forwarded Message-----------------
>
>From:   Lerlin Woodrow,
>To:     Origami List, INTERNET:ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
>
>Date:   03/07/99 20:35
>
>RE:     SIDECAP (Urgent)
>
>Help!!!!!
>Anyone know of a diagram for a sidecap?  I'm told it was worn in the RAF in
>'those' days. :-)
>Desperately needed for a school concert.  Fingers crossed that such a
>diagram exists.
>Direct mail welcome.
>
>Thanks
>Lerlin
>
>
Lerlin,

Try Kenneway's Complete Origami!

Ria





From: DLister891@AOL.COM
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 18:15:29 -0400 (
Subject: Re: NO: Mathematics will Fail?

Two things have always baffled me. One is Reality and the other Mathematics.
Perhaps a third is how Reality and Mathematics are related to each other!

Reality will always be a mystery: Why, oh why, does ANYTHING exist?

But I have found that one way of looking at Mathematics is to regard it as
the Science of PATTERN.

If there is any Pattern in Reality then Mathematics must play a part in
defining or explaining it.

But just WHAT is Mathematics?  Has it an independent existence or is it only
a figment of Man's imagination? Yet, surely, whether or not Man's imagination
exists or not, One and One still make Two?

Yours in perplexity,l

David Lister.





From: DLister891@AOL.COM
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 18:15:32 -0400 (
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Flatland, Sphereland, and The Planiverse

Flatland, Sphereland and the Planiverse.

I agree that Abbot is not purporting to describe any sort of two-dimensional
REALITY in his book, "Flatland".

His whole concept of a two-dimensional universe was an ANALOGY.

If you can IMAGINE a two-dimensional universe and then, from it, IMAGINE how
the super-reality of a three dimensional universe could intrude into it then
it will help us to imagine how a supposed fourth dimension of a
four-dimensional universe could intrude into the three-dimensional universe
of our every-day experience. (I am here considering dimensions of space,
without the added dimension of time.)  It is merely an intellectual exercise,
but I, for one, have found it a very useful one.

If I was pushed. I would say that so far as SPACE is concerned, there are
only three dimensions. But those three dimensions are only the creation our
our human minds. Space of itself has no dimensions or as many as we like to
attribute to it. It doesn't mean to say that other dimensions do not exist in
other ways. Time, for instance, is clearly a dimension. (But, according to
Einstein, time is seemlessly integrated into the three diensions of space.)
Perhaps, too, space really is curved in a fourth dimension  (which would be
something very different from Abbott's simplistic fourth dimension). And, of
course, an infinite number of dimensions can exist in mathematics. Looking
even further out into the mysteries of what may or may not be, what may be
the ten dimensions of the Superstrings?

This is all a long way from simple paperfolding. But, yes, we can regard a
sheet of paper in practice as a two-dimensional entity if (again, for
convenience) we disregard its thickness. But as soon as we fold it we enter
the third dimension. Folding, too, takes time -yet another dimension. Can we
disregard that in practice?

Oh Dear! Oh Dear!!

David.

And as there are so many Davids in this world,
I append my patrimonial name:

Lister.





From: Bob Stack <Noobob@AOL.COM>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 18:52:32 -0400 (
Subject: Re: Rhinoceros models

The convention was, as usual, great!  There was one thing missing, for me and
I think everyone else, namely Joseph Wu.  I missed pestering him for more
submissions to the annual collection.  I and the rest of the attendees missed
him for his wonderful contribution to the quality of the convention and to
origami.  Joseph, you must come next year!!!!!!!!





From: "Juan P. Fernandez" <jpf@DAISY.PHAST.UMASS.EDU>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 20:03:02 -0400
Subject: Pet peeves?

So what are our top ten hates regarding this
list?  I do not have ten, thank the Gods, but
I have a few:

1)  The neverending OUSA thread
2)  Messages saying "Please unsubscribe me"
3)  Replies featuring long quoted paragraphs
4)  Fights between members

That is all for now.  Thanks for listening.

jp





From: Barbra0336@AOL.COM
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 20:19:28 -0400 (
Subject: Re: SIDECAP (Urgent)

In a message dated 7-5-99 11:05:29 AM, Langwood@COMPUSERVE.COM writes:

<< Anyone know of a diagram for a sidecap?  I'm told it was worn in the RAF in
'those' days. :-) >>

Just curious - what is a "sidecap"?  Looked it up in my dictionary and it was
not listed.  Barbara





From: Lerlin Woodrow <Langwood@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 21:30:30 -0400
Subject: Re: SIDECAP (Urgent)

A poor attempt to describe this cap would be a traditional boat (folded
from A4)
without the top triangle and inverted.  A  US army book describes it as
having a vaguely Serbian look and was copied from a French Model.  A
similar cap would have been worn by a Lieutenant-Colonel of the French
Medical Corps(1918 or thereabouts).  His would have been a browny-green.
The RAF's would be blue.  <g> said it was a poor attempt!!!
Ahhh, the Thunderbirds wore it too.
My fingers are crossed, otherwise it will have to be the old 'cutting and
pasting' of sugar paper.





From: Terry Rioux <trioux@WHOI.EDU>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 21:59:35 -0400
Subject: And yet another OUSA Convention Tale

One of the classes I took at OUSA '99 was Pier Paolo Pessina's one-piece
rose with leaves, taught by Jan Polish.  This rose is an elegant color
change model, with a four leaved calyx and a very nice, realistic
flower.  Jan proudly pointed to a tiny, beautiful pin she was wearing of
the model in green and red, telling us that it had been folded by Gay
Merrill Gross.  Both Jan and Gay had learned the rose from Pier Paolo at
last December's CDO convention. Later that evening, I was sitting in the
hospitality room struggling with a practice model while trying
desperately to decipher my scribbled notes. As the model took shape a
few folders came by and wanted to learn it.  Dorothy Kaplan aka Dorigami
was one.  I wasn't sure I could remember the last few steps.  As my
desperation increased I spotted Gay walking past our table and,
remembering the lovely model she had folded for Jan, I asked her if she
could help us.  She not only stopped to help us but also had some very
helpful hints on how to make some of the steps much easier by
prefolding.  Gay is a very classy lady! I was still not completely
satisfied with my kami paper model, but it did resemble the display
model, sort of.

The next day, while on my way to empty my bank account at the OUSA's
Source outlet at FIT's eighth floor, I passed by a display of the
Swedish firm Origami Paper OPP AB.  I had seen their announcement a few
months ago on this list and browsed through their web site.  The
salesman was giving away samples, and one of them was a dark green with
some lighter green streaks on one side and bright yellow on the other.
Called Kraft Skin, it is heavier than kami but lighter than standard
typing/copier paper.  I thanked him and shoved the paper into my  bag,
being preoccupied with spending money (my wife made the grievous error
of giving me the checkbook without telling me how much I could spend ;-}
).

Today, a week after the convention ended, I decided to spend this very
hot day (about 380C) folding instead of doing much needed house
projects. I dragged out my notes and paper, and then spotted the
yellow/green Kraft Skin paper.  The piece I had was a bit large, being a
square 296 mm long on a side (almost 12 inches), so I cut in into 4
pieces.  The rose turned out great. The dark green leaves with the
lighter streaks contrast nicely with the bright yellow flower, sort of a
yellow rose of Tex... well, Sweden! I'm really kicking myself for only
taking one piece, but luckily, I can buy some more from their web site.

Terry Rioux





From: "Michael J. Naughton" <mjnaught@CROCKER.COM>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 22:01:28 -0400
Subject: Re: NO: Mathematics will Fail?

David Lister wrote:
>> Two things have always baffled me. One is Reality and the other Mathematics.
>> Perhaps a third is how Reality and Mathematics are related to each other!  .
. . .

I am reminded of a quote attributed to Bertrand Russell, to the effect that
mathematics is a subject "in which we never know what we are talking about,
nor whether what we are saying is true."

Mike "Perhaps it's not the _only_ subject!" Naughton





From: Sebastian Marius Kirsch <skirsch@T-ONLINE.DE>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 22:10:18 +0200
Subject: Re: Rhinoceros models

On Mon, Jul 05, 1999 at 10:03:29AM -0700, Joseph Wu wrote:
> I still need to take a good picture of the black rhino. For some reason, the
> photos of the white one always turn out reasonably well, but not the black!

Why don't you simply take the picture of the white rhino and invert the
colors to obtain a black rhino?

> There will be crease patterns, but no diagrams...

That has to be sufficient. :-)

--
Yours, Sebastian                                       skirsch@t-online.de
                        /or/ sebastian_kirsch@kl.maus.de (no mail > 16KB!)





From: Russell Sutherland <RGS467@AOL.COM>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 22:46:25 -0400 (
Subject: Re: mathematics will fail?

Grab the waders, Ma.... It's getting deep!





From: Vicky Avery <vavery@WENET.NET>
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 23:54:20 -0700
Subject: Re: Rhinoceros models

Hi -
Just one of those odd bits of trivia stuck in my brain
- the white rhino is actually gray, the name became mispronounced from
"wide-lipped" (wijd in Dutch) as this species has a wide, square lip adapted
for grazing.  It's also larger than the black rhino.

One would think I do well in the game of Trivial Pursuit, but alas... ;)

Vicky

> On Mon, Jul 05, 1999 at 10:03:29AM -0700, Joseph Wu wrote:
>> I still need to take a good picture of the black rhino. For some reason, the
>> photos of the white one always turn out reasonably well, but not the black!
>
> Why don't you simply take the picture of the white rhino and invert the
> colors to obtain a black rhino?





From: Christopher Holt <Ella-mae@EMAIL.MSN.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 00:41:27 -0700
Subject: Re: mathematics will fail?

> I thought the purpose of math was not to be shortchanged!
>
>
> Matthias

Actually, I'm just making excuses for being terrible at seventh's folds.-c





From: zealous Fuse fanatic <origamifreak@YAHOO.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 06:58:07 -0700
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

Oh my, this has interesting possibilities!

As in ecology and paleontology, the order in which
said ungulates were "discovered" by various
researchers may or may not correspond to their
origamivolutionary origins...

To do this rigorously one might need to classify the
creases as taxonomic characters and use a
well-established phylogenetic software package to
infer the branching order and their statistical
(bootstrap) support.

My goodness, Joseph, you have stimulated what I call a
"three-beer-theory" of the kind I usually only
experience when relaxing with other scientists.  And
at 7am with no beers in sight!  :-)

anja

--- Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA> wrote:
> Actually, once I get all the relevant photos
> together, I'll be doing a
> webpage about the "evolution of origami ungulates",
> tracing the progression
> from the Brill/Kasahara/Montroll rhino base to my
> own white and black rhinos
> to the Cape water buffalo and then to the Chinese
> water buffalo.
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com





From: "Chamberlain, Clare" <Clare.Chamberlain@HEALTH.WA.GOV.AU>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 07:55:08 +0800
Subject: favourite anything

Like may on the list, I only have a limited time to read things here -
haven't we already done the favourite models stuff at least once before?  As
for favourite authors (apart form origami books) what's this got to do with
folding?  I did understand the link with other hobbies, but please be
reasonable.  Can I suggest answers to this type of request all go directly
to the original author to then compile and feed back to the list?  It's
almost as infuriating as those endless pages of code or replies full of
repeated message!
Ann on a Mouse!





From: "Wu, Sonia" <swu@BANSHEE.SAR.USF.EDU>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 08:27:02 -0400
Subject: Re: Faye Goldman's Brian Kolins' Big Origami

Faye reported on her son's gargantuan modular--a 3-foot Sonobe
icosahedron submitted for the Convention Exhibition.

Congratulations, Brian!  Our little origami club in Sarasota Florida is
VERY into modulars.  Perhaps we'll do a group icosahedron in your honor
next week....

Sonia Wu





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 09:01:50 +0200
Subject: Re: Women and origami

Christopher Holt wrote:
>What are these so-called 'specified rules' ? Good problem solving should go
>beyond rigorous analysis, and into gestalt. Mathematics ultimately will fail
>in its role as descriptor of the universe, as we realize that reality is the
>sum of more parameters on different scalar levels converging than any
>rigorous method could keep up with. The firmer you try to hold reality, the
>more it squirms out between your fingers. I prefer to see origami as a
>zen-state thing, rather than an excersize in pure reason. All the best-c

Uhm, the subject was not mathematics or gestalt but whether women and
men prefer different approaches to origami. Since all generalisations
are always wrong, I'd say this is not the case.

All the best,
Matthias
P.S.: What exactly is a zen-state thing?





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 09:04:04 +0200
Subject: Re: mathematics will fail?

Christopher Holt wrote:
>In short--the purposes of science and math have become reversed.
>Math should be about the grand scheme, and each science should be the

I thought the purpose of math was not to be shortchanged!

Matthias





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 09:09:28 +0200
Subject: Re: Pet peeves?

5) Top ten lists
<eg>

Matthias





From: Evi <d.evi.l@MUENSTER.DE>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 09:23:51 +0200
Subject: Re: Rhinoceros models

Joseph Wu wrote:

>....There will
be crease patterns, but no diagrams...at least not yet. 8)

I'm still young, I can wait....  :o)
Evi





From: Eduardo Bertucci <eab@AUTOTROL.COM.AR>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 10:14:07 -0300
Subject: Re: NO:  Latin Americans

-----Mensaje original-----
De: Juan P. Fernandez <jpf@DAISY.PHAST.UMASS.EDU>
Para: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU <ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Fecha: Jueves, 24 de Junio de 1999 12:48 p.m.
Asunto: NO: Latin Americans

>...it turns out that I am Colombian too, from
>   Bogota, and a physicist as well.  So far, I
>   have seen that the only Latin Americans on
>   this list are either Colombian (Jose Tomas,
>   Jhonny, Juan Pablo) or Brazilian (Carlos
>   Alberto, Sandra).  Who else from Latin
>   America is here?  .....

    My name is Eduardo Bertucci.   I am from Argentina,
    I am an engeneering and I am quite new to the O-List
    (But not so new folding paper) and this is my first mail posted to the
list.

    I am sure you will found more Latin American folder on the list.

    Best Regards.

    Eduardo

    PS:  Sorry for the delay answering your mail, but I was out of my office
the last weeks.





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 10:21:27 -0700
Subject: Re: 2 questions

At 11:55 99/07/06 +0200, elsje wrote:
>1) Is there a list from members of the origami-list
>who have a homepage with origami in it ?
>Please tell me where I can find it.
>If not, I would like to have your URL
>Because I would like to see all the homepages.

Take a look at my site at <http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca>. It has a
huge list of links to origami websites around the world. Just look in the
"Links" page.

>2) Are there members of the origami-list
>who have a homepage with cats in it ?
>Please send your URL.
>My cats would like to visit your cats.

Sorry, I can't help you with this one.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 10:23:14 -0700
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

At 06:58 99/07/06 -0700, you wrote:
>Oh my, this has interesting possibilities!

I'm glad someone liked it. 8)

>As in ecology and paleontology, the order in which
>said ungulates were "discovered" by various
>researchers may or may not correspond to their
>origamivolutionary origins...

Haha! Well, in this case, I *can* trace the evolution of my models because I
was there directing the changes!

>To do this rigorously one might need to classify the
>creases as taxonomic characters and use a
>well-established phylogenetic software package to
>infer the branching order and their statistical
>(bootstrap) support.

So...do you have such a software package? 8)

>My goodness, Joseph, you have stimulated what I call a
>"three-beer-theory" of the kind I usually only
>experience when relaxing with other scientists.  And
>at 7am with no beers in sight!  :-)

Glad to be of service!

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: zealous Fuse fanatic <origamifreak@YAHOO.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 10:54:29 -0700
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

--- Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA> wrote:
>
> in this case, I *can* trace the
> evolution of my models because I
> was there directing the changes!
>
Are you sure you weren't just discovering the
potential folds as they existed in the universe of all
possible folds from a time before paper existed? ;-)

(I would also add "before squares existed", but that
probably belongs in another concurrent, nefarious
thread.  BTW, I agree it might be the heat, or maybe
it's Cosmic Rays?)

> So...do you have such a software package? 8)
>
Sure.  But I bet Jerry is a better source for this
kind of thing because I imagine he's a real
morphological systematist, whereas I'm only trained in
molecular evolution.

Jerry wrote:
>
>A better (and more interesting) approach would be to
>examine to what degree the crease patterns are
similar >for origami models of progressively more
distantly
>related ungulate taxa -- that is, see if there's any
>correspondence between folding techniques/design
>similarities and phylogenetic similarities.
>
Oh dear, now you're getting serious on us!

>one would have to establish the relationships amongst
>creases first and assess which are primitive and
which >are derived
>
Spoken like a true Cladist!  ;-)

But there actually is a scheme out there, is there
not, that classifies models according to crease
similarities?  I suppose that would probably be the
best way to handle straight classification.

As far as understanding Joseph's personal creative
process, it probably wouldn't correspond, although I
agree it would be fun to find out.

anja
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com





From: Scott Cramer <scram@LANDMARKNET.NET>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 10:59:13 -0400
Subject: Thread or Superstring?

       Did the origami list merge with Mensa, or is it just the heat? I
enjoy omphaloskepsis as much as the next guy, but this hardly seems the
proper forum for resolving the riddles of the universe. On the other hand,
it is probably more productive than political squabbling.
       Here's a question- does the appearance at this year's convention of a
number of modular moneyfolds imply anything about the economy? Does Alan
Greenspan know about this?
      Pondering prodigiously,
Scott





From: "elsje van der ploeg, elst nl" <evdploeg@BETUWE.NET>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 11:55:01 +0200
Subject: 2 questions

Dear friends,

1) Is there a list from members of the origami-list
who have a homepage with origami in it ?
Please tell me where I can find it.
If not, I would like to have your URL
Because I would like to see all the homepages.

2) Are there members of the origami-list
who have a homepage with cats in it ?
Please send your URL.
My cats would like to visit your cats.

xxxxxx elsje





From: Cathy <cathypl@GENERATION.NET>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 12:47:38 -0400
Subject: Re: [NO] Re: Flatland, Sphereland, and The Planiverse

At 06:15 PM 99-07-05 EDT, you wrote:

>If I was pushed. I would say that so far as SPACE is concerned, there are
>only three dimensions. But those three dimensions are only the creation our
>our human minds. Space of itself has no dimensions or as many as we like to
>attribute to it. It doesn't mean to say that other dimensions do not exist in
>other ways. Time, for instance, is clearly a dimension. (But, according to
>Einstein, time is seemlessly integrated into the three diensions of space.)
>Perhaps, too, space really is curved in a fourth dimension  (which would be
>something very different from Abbott's simplistic fourth dimension). And, of
>course, an infinite number of dimensions can exist in mathematics. Looking
>even further out into the mysteries of what may or may not be, what may be
>the ten dimensions of the Superstrings?
...........................>
>David.
>
>And as there are so many Davids in this world,
>I append my patrimonial name:
>
>Lister.

This is so weird!  I belong to the RASC astronomy list as well and never
expected to confuse the two lists.  Would you believe the RASC list is also
trying to deal with a surplus of Davids?  Not to mention Flatland, and the
curving of space.

As a teacher, I often run into problems explaining that polygons are only
2-D, they have too much experience with paper being called squares and
rectangles, which mathematically speaking, they are not.  This weekend I
had fun folding unicorns and flying horses for Toronto Trek, and I can
assure you there are three dimensions to a square--the thickness of the
many layers of paper in the legs is proof of it.

                                                Cathy

******^^^^^*****^^^^^*****

Cathy Palmer-Lister
Ste. Julie, Quebec
Canada
cathypl@generation.net





From: "Jerry D. Harris" <102354.2222@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 13:09:36 -0400
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

Message text written by Origami List
>As in ecology and paleontology, the order in which
said ungulates were "discovered" by various
researchers may or may not correspond to their
origamivolutionary origins...

To do this rigorously one might need to classify the
creases as taxonomic characters and use a
well-established phylogenetic software package to
infer the branching order and their statistical
(bootstrap) support.<

        A better (and more interesting) approach would be to examine to
what degree the crease patterns are similar for origami models of
progressively more distantly related ungulate taxa -- that is, see if
there's any correspondence between folding techniques/design similarities
and phylogenetic similarities.  (My guess is:  no, there isn't -- there's
too many ways to fold the same subject, and those methods aren't
necessarily related!)

        However, to appropriately fill in a data matrix with creases, one
would have to establish the relationships amongst creases first and assess
which are primitive and which are derived -- obviously mountain and valley
folds are the most basal, but beyond that, figuring out the "evolution" of
other crease patterns would be virtually impossible!
                _,_
           ____/_\,)                    ..  _
--____-===(  _\/                         \\/ \-----_---__
           /\  '                        ^__/>/\____\--------
__________/__\_ ____________________________.//__.//_________

                     Jerry D. Harris
                 Fossil Preparation Lab
          New Mexico Museum of Natural History
                   1801 Mountain Rd NW
               Albuquerque  NM  87104-1375
                 Phone:  (505) 841-2809
                  Fax:  (505) 841-2866
               102354.2222@compuserve.com





From: Manuel Nuno Alcada <nunoalca@MED.UP.PT>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 15:44:25 +0100
Subject: Re: NO:  Latin Americans

At 11:47 AM 6/24/99 -0400, you wrote:
>...it turns out that I am Colombian too, from
>   Bogota, and a physicist as well.  So far, I
>   have seen that the only Latin Americans on
>   this list are either Colombian (Jose Tomas,
>   Jhonny, Juan Pablo) or Brazilian (Carlos
>   Alberto, Sandra).  Who else from Latin
>   America is here?  Spaniards like Morgana
>   or Pedro Luis can be considered "honorary"
>   members of our continent, I guess.
>
>   So, Spanish and Portuguese speakers:  How

I'm a portuguese folder!

I teach Biochemistry in a Medical School in Porto (Oporto as many foreign
people say).

Despite the fact I fold origami for many years, I'm still a beginner
because only recently I really have discovered the origami world throu
Internet and this wonderful list.

I don't know many people here in Portugal doing Origami. Is there any
Portuguese here?

Best wishes
Manuel Nuno





From: Ronald Koh <ronkoh@SINGNET.COM.SG>
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 00:10:31 +0800
Subject: Re: Rhinoceros models

I'm no longer young - I can't. Make it sooner rather than later, Joe.

Evi wrote:
>
> Joseph Wu wrote:
>
> >....There will
> be crease patterns, but no diagrams...at least not yet. 8)
>
> I'm still young, I can wait....  :o)
> Evi





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 12:36:25 -0700
Subject: Re: 2 questions

At 21:23 99/07/06 +0200, Matthias wrote:
>Yes you can, or did you forget about your search engine for diagrams on
>the web?
>Follow the "Diagrams" link, then the "Published on Internet" link, enter
>"cat" into the search field, and presto! there is a list of origami
>homepages with cats. Plus a few catapults and caterpillars...

<smack myself on the forehead!>
I forgot about that! Thanks for the reminder, Matthias.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Michael LaFosse <info@ORIGAMIDO.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 14:30:37 -0400
Subject: Auction item - "The World of Origami" by Honda - Hardcover

Hi folks,

I know some of you have been looking for this book, so here is a quick
note to let you know about this collector's item origami book offering
at the Amazon.com auction (closes in six days):

"The World of Origami", by Honda - Full, hardcover edition, 1973.
                Link to the auction for item:
http://auctions.amazon.com/exec/varzea/ts/auction-glance/Y01X0779083X7224237

Good Luck!

Michael LaFosse





From: Perry Bailey <pbailey@OPENCOMINC.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 14:51:57 -0500
Subject: Re: Rhinoceros models

Joseph Wu wrote:

> Actually, once I get all the relevant photos together, I'll be doing a
> webpage about the "evolution of origami ungulates", tracing the progression
> from the Brill/Kasahara/Montroll rhino base to my own white and black rhinos
> to the Cape water buffalo and then to the Chinese water buffalo.

Now there's something to look forward to, take note this is going
to be a bonanza of infromation on how Joseph does his design
work, and should be a lot of fun to look through!

> There will
> be crease patterns, but no diagrams...at least not yet. 8)

Thats OK crease paterns are a fun way of driving your self crazy!

Perry
--
pbailey@opencominc.com
http://www.afgsoft.com/perry/  <---- Origami Web Page with
Diagrams!
ICQ 23622644





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 15:59:37 -0700
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

At 17:48 99/07/06 -0400, you wrote:
>Joseph, I am not a scientist just an origamist and would like to know what
>ungulates mean in the evolution of origami.

Here's a blurb from "The Ultimate Ungulate Homepage" at
<http://www.pathcom.com/~dhuffman/homepage.html>

@> Although Ungulata is no longer a considered to be a proper
@> taxonomic category, it is still used as a practical, descriptive
@> name to group together a group of mammals. Ungulates [a fancy
@> word for hoofed mammals] have developed hooves - specialized
@> claws or toe-nails - as an adaptation for running. All modern
@> ungulates are descended from Condylarthra, an extinct order of
@> hoofed mammals. Six taxonomic orders compose the ungulates -
@> Tubulidentata, Hyracoidea, Probiscidea, Sirenia, Perissodactyla,
@> and Artiodactyla. The first four of these orders are considered
@> paenungulates (almost ungulates) as their hooves are more
@> nail-hoofs. Since the beginning of the 20th century, more new
@> ungulate species have been discovered than any other type of
@> large mammal.

The rhino is a member of Perissodactyla (odd-toed ungulates) and the water
buffalo is a member of Artiodactyla (even-toed ungulates).

>I am always interested in the
>evolution of the model and who thought of the first step in its evolution and
>what the succeeding steps were.

Well, I'm only going to trace my own thought processes during the design of
this particular series of models (rhinos and buffaloes).

>I suspect that each model has many
>designers, each building on the others......branching order, now that's an
>interesting idea....

Well, if you want to trace things back to their ultimate roots then you
might be able to say that "each model has many designers", but that sort of
attribution is next to impossible to keep track of. I design "from scratch"
these days, although I realized that I've been influenced by the work of
numerous others. I do my best to give credit whenever I've used what I
consider to be a major idea from someone else.

>I am leaning to believing that many of the early
>practioners of origami were magicians and used it in performing.

And what leads you to this belief?

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t: 604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331  e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: zealous Fuse fanatic <origamifreak@YAHOO.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 16:06:51 -0700
Subject: Re: ungulates

Since I'm an evolutionary biologist as well as a
paperfolder, and since the thread is partly my fault,
I'll attempt to field this one.

Ungulate just means "hooved quadruped."  Some familiar
ungulates are: pigs, horses, rhinos, oxen, sheep, and
deer.

As for what they mean in the evolution of origami, I
suppose they are muses (yes, mooses are also
ungulates, but I'm referring to inspiration here :-)
for many popular artists.

As for the link to magic, I agree they're very close.
In fact, back in my early grad school days I once
played an illusionist magician in a D&D game, and
folded appropriate pre-designated models corresponding
to my spells real-time during melee.  I even had
special paper chosen that corresponded with how "real"
an illusion was supposed to be.  It sure added to the
excitement, but we won't go there.  ;-)

anja

--- DORIGAMI@AOL.COM wrote:
> I am not a scientist just an origamist and
> would like to know what
> ungulates mean in the evolution of origami.   I am
> always interested in the
> evolution of the model and who thought of the first
> step in its evolution and
> what the succeeding steps were.   I suspect that
> each model has many
> designers, each building on the
> others......branching order, now that's an
> interesting idea....I am leaning to believing that
> many of the early
> practioners of origami were magicians and used it in
> performing.
>

_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com





From: "Jerry D. Harris" <102354.2222@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 16:12:44 -0400
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

Message text written by Origami List
>> So...do you have such a software package? 8)
>
Sure.  But I bet Jerry is a better source for this
kind of thing because I imagine he's a real
morphological systematist, whereas I'm only trained in
molecular evolution.<

        There are, as one might imagine, numerous such software packages,
most (if not all; I've only worked with about 2 of them!) should work
equally well with molecular or morphological data.

>Oh dear, now you're getting serious on us!<

        8-D

>Spoken like a true Cladist!  ;-) <

        Actually, I'm not much of a cladist -- I use the techniques, but I
view the theories as simply a set of testable hypotheses, and not the
"gospel truth" the way many of the cult-cladist paleontologists (and other
biology-based scientists!) do, in which cladistics is the be-all, end-all
of all systematic science, and even makes fundamental practice, like
_geology_, useless!

>But there actually is a scheme out there, is there
not, that classifies models according to crease
similarities?  I suppose that would probably be the
best way to handle straight classification.<

        I've not seen an explicit explanation of any such scheme, although
I've seen "intuitive" sorts of things along these lines utilized.  It could
answer all sorts of questions, like which is harder:  a model with 42
closed sinks and 58 box pleats, or one with 58 closed sinks and 42 box
pleats?  If one can demonstrate that closed sinks are harder than box
pleats, well, then...

                _,_
           ____/_\,)                    ..  _
--____-===(  _\/                         \\/ \-----_---__
           /\  '                        ^__/>/\____\--------
__________/__\_ ____________________________.//__.//_________

                     Jerry D. Harris
                 Fossil Preparation Lab
          New Mexico Museum of Natural History
                   1801 Mountain Rd NW
               Albuquerque  NM  87104-1375
                 Phone:  (505) 841-2809
                  Fax:  (505) 841-2866
               102354.2222@compuserve.com





From: Doug Philips <dwp@TRANSARC.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 16:36:46 -0400
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

Jerry D. Harris wrote:
>         I've not seen an explicit explanation of any such scheme, although
> I've seen "intuitive" sorts of things along these lines utilized.  It could
> answer all sorts of questions, like which is harder:  a model with 42
> closed sinks and 58 box pleats, or one with 58 closed sinks and 42 box
> pleats?  If one can demonstrate that closed sinks are harder than box
> pleats, well, then...

Actually, John Smith of the B.O.S. has already started a framework for this,
though I can't recall if he took it as far as sinks and wraps. As I recall, he
had a paper about it in COET95, and talked about it at COET95 (which was held
in NYC just after the OUSA convention, if memory serves).

I just checked the BOS web site and couldn't find anything about this, there.

-D'gou





From: DORIGAMI@AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 17:48:14 -0400 (
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

Joseph, I am not a scientist just an origamist and would like to know what
ungulates mean in the evolution of origami.   I am always interested in the
evolution of the model and who thought of the first step in its evolution and
what the succeeding steps were.   I suspect that each model has many
designers, each building on the others......branching order, now that's an
interesting idea....I am leaning to believing that many of the early
practioners of origami were magicians and used it in performing.





From: Deg Farrelly <DEG.FARRELLY@ASU.EDU>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 19:37:22 -0700
Subject: Re: General OUSA 99 Comments.

Doug Phillips wrote:

<Model Menu:
The model menu was well done. Thanks to deg and his volunteers! I must
say that it was rather crowded, and deg and co. did a great job of
getting everything to fit (getting everything to F.I.T. is a different
matter, but I digress). I don't see many alternatives, since there
isn't a whole lot of room to make the model menu bigger, and the only
option would be to start limiting the number of classes taught.  Since
the model menu has to be viewed from a distance, reducing the size of
the models would not be an option, IMHO.>

A little more information about Model Menu in general:

Model Menu displays about 150 models (I counted 144 this year), organized by
1) difficulty level (Simple, Intermediate, Complex); 2) Class day (Saturday
or Sunday) and 3) Class meeting time (10:00, 11:00, 2:00, 3:00, 4:00., each
with an accompanying card that IDs the model by name and lists the designer,
teacher, class time, and difficulty level (differentiating Low Intermediate
and High Intermediate, for example.  All displayed in 72 linear feet of
tables.

To accommodate variances in how models need to be seen (some display better
laid flat, others at "eye level") the display is constructed as stairsteps.

This year we had more than enough space for Simple models, but were really
cramped for the Intermediate.  Next year we will add another 12 feet of
display space for the Intermediate models, and cut back the space for Simple
(Unless there are more Simple models taught)

The crush of attendees clamoring to examine models is one of the reasons
that we have set the models off with theatre ropes.  Unlike Exhibition,
which people can visit at various times of day, there is a tremendous demand
to view the models on Friday nite, and Saturday morning, so that attendees
can select the classes they are going to take.

We have a total of 7 hours to set up Model Menu, including moving tables
into place, setting up the display steps, unwrapping and placing all the
models, hanging signage and being prepared for the crowd.

My thanx to those who sent their models ahead so that they could be
organized for placement!

deg farrelly
StickmanAZ@aol.com





From: Thoki Yenn <thok@THOK.DK>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 20:07:17 +0200
Subject: APPOLOGY

This is Kalmon lowering his trombine in shame

I am sorry that I gave the impression
that the method of changing
American Letter Size Paper into Silver Rectangle
also worked for any Rectangle.
This have now been corrected.
I have added a method that also works
when the rectangle is longer than
a Silver Rectangle.

Have look at
www.thok.dk\geometry.html

there is still gold to found there.

Kalmon the not so great and less glorious.





From: Valerie Vann <valerie_vann@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 20:19:43 -0400
Subject: NO? defining the Universe?

Defining the Universe?
Engineering the Universe?
Folding the Universe?
sounds origami-ish to me...

Christopher Holt wrote:
  yet in this century,
  science has become glorified engineering, (no offense to the engineers out
  there, but you know that your functions as engineers are not tied to
  creating a greater understanding of the universe's fundamental essence).

Well in my branch of engineering (hydraulics and hydrology), we don't
exactly claim to be a science, it's more of an "art", kind of
a big "judgement fold". A favorite quote is:

"It is the art of engineering to reach sufficient conclusions
from insufficient data"

Valerie Vann





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 21:23:28 +0200
Subject: Re: 2 questions

Joseph Wu wrote:
> >2) Are there members of the origami-list
> >who have a homepage with cats in it ?
> >Please send your URL.
> >My cats would like to visit your cats.
>
> Sorry, I can't help you with this one.

Yes you can, or did you forget about your search engine for diagrams on
the web?
Follow the "Diagrams" link, then the "Published on Internet" link, enter
"cat" into the search field, and presto! there is a list of origami
homepages with cats. Plus a few catapults and caterpillars...

Matthias





From: Dorothy Engleman <FoldingCA@WEBTV.NET>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 22:13:06 -0700
Subject: Re: Women and origami

When I was curating models for Folding California, I was dismayed and
puzzled by the paucity of women designers.

Where are the female Robert Langs, John Montrolls, Neal Eliases, Michael
LaFosses, Marc Kirschenbaums, David Brills, Max Hulmes, Joseph Wus,
Kunihiko Kasaharas, Yoshihide Momotanis, Issei Yoshinos, Eric Joisels,
Vicente Palacios, etcetera, etcetera.

Why aren't there more Patricia Crawfords and Tomoko Fuses in the origami
world?

Dorothy





From: Rjlang@AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 22:40:51 -0400 (
Subject: Re: Ant and Lobster

David Whitbeck wrote:

> I have a few questions.  Lang's ant is a wonderful fold in it it's
> simplicity yet as a great 3d shape and the right number legs, etc.
> but all of the ants that I've noticed have longer legs than this
> ant.  Is there a species that matches Lang's ant?  Also does
> anybody have any ideas on how to fold longer legs?

David raises a couple of interesting questions. He has noticed a fact of most
origami insects: their legs are shorter, relative to their body size, than
those of the real creature. (They're also much fatter, too, which is
important, as we'll see in a minute.)

So the question arises: why is this so? The simple answer might be, "it's too
hard to make the legs any longer." But that's not really the case any more,
because using mathematical origami design techniques we can make the legs any
length we want. In fact, you could take the existing Ant with its too-short
legs and by taking pleats in the head and abdomen, reduce their size relative
to that of the legs.

But if you fold an insect whose legs are really as long as the original (for
example, from a photo), you'll find that it frequently doesn't "look right."
It looks "too leggy." This is a paradox: the more anatomically correct you
make it, the less correct it looks.

Here's why, and it relates to human perception. Your eye picks up how much
_area_, not _length_, is devoted to the legs. Real insect legs are impossibly
thin. Origami insect legs tend to be much fatter; so if the legs are the
right length but are 10x too fat, it looks to your eye like "there's too much
leg there."

So, the origami artist adjusts the length a bit to try to compensate. We come
back to the fact that even "realistic" origami is not, and never will be, a
photographic art; what you are trying to capture is the essence of the
subject, and the origami designer must constantly balance the amount of
detail against other considerations like clutteredness, number of
thicknesses, elegance of folding sequence, and so forth. And the apparent
visual area of the legs, as well.

Hope that answers your questions, David.

Best regards,

Robert J. Lang





From: Eric Andersen <ema@NETSPACE.ORG>
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 23:03:26 -0400
Subject: Re: 2 questions

On Tue, 6 Jul 1999, elsje van der ploeg, elst nl wrote:

>1) Is there a list from members of the origami-list
>who have a homepage with origami in it ?

Elsje,
I have a page:

http://www.paperfolding.com

which also happens to have links to lots of other great origami Web sites:

http://www.paperfolding.com/links/pages.html

>My cats would like to visit your cats.

Hmmm...it's just amazing what can be done over the Web these days...

-Eric :-P
origami@netspace.org

/=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=\
\   Eric Andersen                                       /
/    Mathematics, Music             ~  ~ __o            \
\     and Origami                 ~  ~ _-\<'_           /
/      ema@netspace.org        ~    ~ (_)/ (_)          \
\=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=/
         *** http://www.paperfolding.com ***





From: DORIGAMI@AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 23:58:45 -0400 (
Subject: Re: evolution of origami

Early practioners of Origami perhaps were magicians?  Well, the reason I tend
to believe that magicians were the early practioners of Origami is that
Origami can be a performing art and magicians are really inventors
extraordinaire and performers.  The flapping bird is a perfect example of a
magic trick.  I dont think the general public had access to paper in the past
and magicians might have been able to acquire it.  Or people who think like
magicians.  From the magicians I know, they have a certain mind set that many
of my origami friends have and they love the magical quality of many origami
models.  I dont think that most people in the early days had much time for
playing around with paper.  I often use Origami as a performance art and
often I surprize people with an action toy and they really enjoy the
surprises that are forthcoming from certain models.....This is only my own
conjecture, don't take it for gospel.  Magicians as you well know often use
paper in their acts, paper cutting, paper tearing, paper folding,  and story
telling of a sort.  Paper is an easy and inexpensive medium to use compared
to the cost of most other materials for creating a magic illusion.  I
personally find many origami models simply astounding and the whole process
absolutely magical.....Dorigami





From: Douglas Zander <dzander@SOLARIA.SOL.NET>
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 02:05:04 -0500 (
Subject: Re: Women and origami

>
> Why aren't there more Patricia Crawfords and Tomoko Fuses in the origami
> world?
>
> Dorothy
>

 I might be able to give a clue, same reason that there weren't (until
 recently) more women mathematicians, and engineers.  It might have
 something to do with upbringing.  Historically, women weren't encouraged
 to excel in mathematics and the sciences (and to some part in geometry
 and origami).  I have read studies where boys were called upon more often
 during math class and science class by their teachers.  Also, parents may
 have a hand in this too; guideing their young sons to "manly things" like
 science and math and guideing their daughters towards "girly things" like
 looking pretty, cleaning house, and cooking.

 OTOH: I have read reports that men and women use their brains differently
 when solving math problems; supposedly giving credance to the theory that
 just maybe men are better at math and science.

 Off Topic: did anyone read recently how they found that Einstein's brain
 was physically different from most everyone else's?  Very interesting,
 supposedly his brain was so different that he had to have been *born* with
 the differences (he could not have developed the differences while growing up)
 and he was destined for genius from birth!!

--
 Douglas Zander                |
 dzander@solaria.sol.net       |
 Shorewood, Wisconsin, USA     |





From: DLister891@AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 02:25:38 -0400 (
Subject: Re: evolution of origami ungulates

Dorigami wrote this morning - or was is last night? - time is so reltive, you
see -

<< I am leaning to believing that many of the early
 practioners of origami were magicians and used it in performing.
  >>

This is a subject which hs seriously interested me for a long time (another
relative term). I hope to write an article about magicians and origami, but
frankly,a t the moment, I have too much on.

I doubt if paperfolding _originated_ with magicians, but over the history of
paperfolding they have certainly played a big part in it. If troublewit can
be counted paperfolding, then troblewit was certinly the field of magicians
and the earliest instructions for a paper fold that we have found so far is
for troublewit..

The Flapping Bird is said to have been intoroduced to the West by Japanese
magicians in the 19th Century (or were they relly Chinese magicians?)

The erly writers of books on paperfolding, William D. Murray, Francis J
Rigney, Will Blythe, and Houdini were all magicians. So was Robert Harbin.

Money Folding was the preserve of the magicians before World War II. Martin
Gardner was a magician. So were Robert Neale, and Neal Elias. Many a
paperfolder carries a magician's wand in his knapsack.

Of course, the reason is simple: Origami is simply Magic!

Dvid Lister,

Grimsby, England.

DLister891@AOL.com





From: "Wu, Sonia" <swu@BANSHEE.SAR.USF.EDU>
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 08:08:38 -0400
Subject: Re: Tomoko Fuse : Spirals/Availability in US Book Shops

Allan Findlay asked if Tomoko Fuse's Spirals books are generally
available in US book shops.  Sadly, no (not even in the foreign language
section of Barnes and Noble).  However, Sasuga bookstores in the Boston
area may well carry them (they have a website--you can probably link to
it from Joseph Wu's website).

Her first Spirals books is one of my very favorites, for one of the
four-unit seashells (which our origami club is going to fold this week)!

Sonia Wu





From: "Chamberlain, Clare" <Clare.Chamberlain@HEALTH.WA.GOV.AU>
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 08:36:50 +0800
Subject: Mathematics will Fail? I hope so.

Am I the only one on the list who belongs to the 'one, two three, many'
school of counting/mathematics?  Of course paper is flat - (unless it's a
favourite piece and will therefore get crumpled at the bottom of any
drawer)and the fun of folding is to unflatten it into something fun!
YES - I've come out of the closet -  I fold for FUN!!  none of this
scientific, chaos, philosophy crap!  (Mind you chaos and origami do
sometimes coincide...)  The closest to philosophy I get is 'I think
therefore I fold!' (Often confused with 'I drink therefore I fold')
By the by...in South East Asia there is a really cute miniature rhino (or is
it a hippo) - very rare, but would make a great model.  Our local zoo's Male
white rhino's looking for a mate - maybe should make a range of life size
models and let him be the judge of which is best  ;-).





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 09:02:31 +0200
Subject: Re: Ant and Lobster

Robert Lang wrote about the relative lenght of insect legs:
>Here's why, and it relates to human perception. Your eye picks up how much
>_area_, not _length_, is devoted to the legs. Real insect legs are impossibly
>thin. Origami insect legs tend to be much fatter; so if the legs are the
>right length but are 10x too fat, it looks to your eye like "there's too much
>leg there."

That's an interesting point, I never thought about how our perception
can make things look 'wrong' although they are 'right'. Ants are really
interesting insects. Here's a story that is not at all about origami,
but about ants:

After the convention in Hildesheim, I hiked through the nice, hilly and
wooded "Leinenbergerland" (that's what the area around Hildesheim is
called). All of a sudden there were ants crawling all over the trail,
and I noticed a large ant hill. A few meters later there was another ant
hill, and then one more, and another one... This went on for about 300
meters, and then there were no more ant hills. I suppose this specific
stretch had just the right weather conditions for those ants; I've never
seen so many ant hills before!

Matthias, crawling...





From: DORIGAMI@AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 09:05:56 -0400 (
Subject: Re: evolution of origami

Thank you David, for those insights into some of the evolution of
paperfolding..  I don't think either that magicians necessarily invented
folding paper, but it couldnt have been long after paper was invented that
they discovered that if you folded a piece of paper in half either on the
diagonal or like a bookfold that you could get the flaps to wave like a bird
and perhaps that was the first step toward the flapping bird.  I think paper
weaving may have come first because you could weave reeds (before paper was
invented) and sometimes that involved some folding.  Maybe that thinking led
to trying to fold paper when it became of a texture that was foldable.  I
guess that early paper would crack so paper texture was important to the
evolution of Origami.  Maybe it was at this point that mathmatically thinking
people began to see the math of origami.  I think that the early pajarita was
math oriented as I think  it starts with 16 squares. And then perhaps the
magicians who like performing and getting attention discovered the attention
getting qualities of origami and then it was off to the races from there on
in.
        I really love the fact that Houdini was a practioner of Origami.   He
died the year I was born and and secretly  I have thought that was sort of
mystical.
Well, all of this is conjecture on my part and I can't wait for David to
write about magicians involvement in origami.
        By the way, for those of you who don't know it, there is a
wonderfully interesting paper museum in Atlanta called the Dard Hunter Paper
Museum...you can find it on the internet that has a wonderful exhibit of the
evolution of paper and about the papermaking industry.  I guess it was this
museum that really set me to thinking.  If any of you are ever in Atlanta,
this museum is a must.

>>I doubt if paperfolding _originated_ with magicians, but over the history of
paperfolding they have certainly played a big part in it. If troublewit can
be counted paperfolding, then troblewit was certinly the field of magicians
and the earliest instructions for a paper fold that we have found so far is
for troublewit..from David Lister>>





From: Allan findlay <a_findlay@EXCHANGE.CREATIONS.CO.UK>
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 09:12:37 +0100
Subject: Tomoko Fuse : Spirals

I should be going to Boston at the end of the month. It is work related but
I will hopefully have a day to look around.
I was just wondering if Tomoko Fuse's Spirals is generally available in book
shops in the US.
--------------------------
        Allan           (a_findlay@exchange.creations.co.uk)





From: Allan findlay <a_findlay@EXCHANGE.CREATIONS.CO.UK>
Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 09:19:29 +0100
Subject: Re: Women and origami

>>
>> Why aren't there more Patricia Crawfords and Tomoko
>> Fuses in the origami world?
>>
> I might be able to give a clue, same reason that there weren't (until
> recently) more women mathematicians, and engineers.  It might have
> something to do with upbringing.  Historically, women weren't encouraged
<snip>
>
>
It may be, but just a couple of days ago my son (7) 'found' one of my
origami books and started trying to make things, my daughter (9) has never
shown any interest in it at all.
Similarly we bought lego & meccano for my daughter when she was younger but
after a short play with it she lost interest, my son on the other hand sits
and plays with it for ages and keeps coming back to it.

So, what I am basically trying to say is that maybe boys & girls are just
different.
--------------------------
        Allan           (a_findlay@exchange.creations.co.uk)
