




From: Hideko et Yvon <origami@FRANCOMEDIA.QC.CA>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 09:35:01 -0400
Subject:

> English version follows.
> --
> Oyez! Oyez!
>
> La prochaine runion de Origami Montral se tiendra:
> ======================================================================
>     Le dimanche 20 septembre prochain, de 13h  16h,
>     au 6848 Christophe-Colomb, Montral.
> ======================================================================
>
> Au menu:
>     - Discussions: vnements locaux, vnements internationaux,
>       nouveaux livres, nouvelles interressantes, etc.
>     - Planification/Annonce de la prochaine runion.
>     - Atelier de pliage prsent par Grard Blais
>         1er modle: pliage simple (modle  dterminer).
>          2e modle: La clbre "Rose" de Mr. Toshikazu Kawasaki.
>     - Pliage libre, discussion, etc.
>
> Du matriel d'origami (i.e. du papier) sera fourni sur place pour ceux
> et celles qui en auront besoin.
>
> Soyez-y!
>
> Grard, pour Origami Montral.
>
> +-----+ Origami Montral
> |     | tlphone & tlcopieur: (450) 448-2530 (Hideko Sinto)
> |     | courrier lectronique: origami@francomedia.qc.ca (Hideko Sinto)
> +-----+ web: http://www.ecn.ulaval.ca/~pgon/origami/origami.html
>
> ======================================================================
> POSTSCRIPTUM
>
> Cet t, les membres d'Origami Montral se sont runis pour discuter
> de l'avenir et de la structure de notre groupe.  Nous avons dfinis
> les bases d'oprations suivantes:
>
>     * Frquence, format et organisation des runions du club
>     * Frais de membre
>     * Local
>     * Contact officiel de Origami Montral
>     * Activits de groupe
>     * Projets futurs
>
> Si vous dsirez en savoir plus sur ces points, consultez les minutes
> de la runion  http://www.ecn.ulaval.ca/~pgon/origami/histoire.html
>
>
>
>
> --
> Hear! Hear!
>
> The next meeting of Origami Montral will be held:
> ======================================================================
>     Sunday, September 20, from 1 PM to 4 PM,
>     at 6848 Christophe-Colomb, Montral.
> ======================================================================
>
> On the menu:
>     - Discussions: local events, international events, new books,
>         interesting news, etc.
>     - Planification/Annoncement of the next meeting.
>     - Folding workshop presented by Grard Blais
>         1st model: simple fold (model to be determined).
>         2nd model: The famous "Rose" of Mr. Toshikazu Kawasaki.
>     - Free folding, discussion, etc.
>
> Origami material (i.e. paper) will be provided for those who need it.
>
> Be there!
>
>
> Grard, on behalf of Origami Montral.
>
> +-----+ Origami Montral
> |     | telephone & fax: (450) 448-2530 (Hideko Sinto)
> |     | email: origami@francomedia.qc.ca (Hideko Sinto)
> +-----+ web: http://www.ecn.ulaval.ca/~pgon/origami/origami.html
>
> ======================================================================
> POSTSCRIPTUM
>
> This summer, the members of Origami Montral have met to discuss the
> future and the structure of our group.  We have defined the following
> basis of operation:
>
>     * Frequency, format and organisation of the reunions
>     * Membership fees
>     * Meeting place
>     * Official contact of Origami Montral
>     * Group activities
>     * Futur projects
>
> If you wish to know more about these items, see the minutes of our
> meeting at http://www.ecn.ulaval.ca/~pgon/origami/histoire.html
> (In french).





From: Renata Fontenelle <ren@NLINK.COM.BR>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 10:40:21 -0300
Subject: Re: Folded flying discs?

At 06:28 10/09/98 +0100, you wrote:
>I have made adjustable indoor throwing discs out of cardstock for years ---
>call them Flugels --- from the German word for fly. Can throw them about 50
>feet.
>
>My designs require indenting, creasing and cutting. Does anyone know of a
>design(s) for a Frisbee-like (somebody's trademark) throwing disc that does
>not require cutting?
>
>I can send a scan of one of our discs as a jpeg or giff attachment to an
>email if anyone is interested. I hesitate attaching the scan to this
>message --- because it may be clutter to many.

Hi, Martin.

Would you mind sending me this scan?
I'd appreciate it!
Thanks a bunch,
Renata





From: Jeannine Mosely <j9@CONCENTRA.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 10:42:40 -0400
Subject: Re: Folded flying discs?

I have a design for a very simple flying ring made from 6 american
business cards -- just three creases per card.  You have to use
american cards, or cards in the same proportions, 4:7 (which is very
close to sqrt(3):1).

Fold two opposite corners to touch and unfold.  There is now a short
diagonal crease across the card, that makes a 60 degree angle with
each of the long edges.  Add two creases bi-secting those angles
(besure to bisect the 60 degree angle -- not the 120 degree angle).
All the creases are valley folds.  Fold up all the creases to make a
kind of bow-tie shape.  Make 6 of these, and be sure that they are all
identical -- no mirror images.  Now slip the end of one module into
the tube formed by the end of its neighbor module, and keep adding
them till the six are linked in a hexagonal ring, with a hexagonal
hole in the middle.

The links aren't strong, and it can be pulled apart quite easily, but
friction holds it together well enough and it flies quite nicely.

I have another design for a flying star, but it's not so easy to
explain in words ...

        -- Jeannine Mosely





From: patricia johnston <patricia_johnston@BC.SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 11:24:36 -0700
Subject: Hi etc.

Hello All,
I am new to the list, and say Hi. I have just started doing origami, and
what a lovely art form it is. So can someone give me some hints for a
beginner?, especially what kind of paper, and some web addresses that give
instructions.
Thanks
Pat.





From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 11:56:34 -0700
Subject: Re: Origami Foil Suppliers (addendum #2)

At 14:02 98/09/17 -0400, you wrote:
>So in the final analysis, *nobody* offers much color choice at all in
>Japanese foils.  Which isn't because the colors aren't manufactured - you do
>get various colors in the assortments, but typically only two sheets of a
>given color per pack.

Learn Japanese, join NOA (Nippon Origami Association), and order from their
stock. Never say nobody until you've talked to everybody. 8)

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t:604.730.0306 x 105   f: 604.732.7331   e: josephwu@ultranet.ca
w: http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca





From: Gareth Morfill <gmorfill@REDBRICK.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 12:18:34 -0400
Subject: Re: Folded flying discs?

At 10:42 AM 9/17/98 -0400, you wrote:
>
>I have another design for a flying star, but it's not so easy to
>explain in words ...
>
Jeanine,
Please please please could you try!!! It would really be appreciated by all
of us who enjoy folding business cards. Off to try the model you just
described and annoy every one in the office with it!
Thanks - Gareth





From: patricia johnston <patricia_johnston@BC.SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 12:26:15 -0700
Subject: discs gif/jpeg

Hello Mr. Carlone,
Would you please send me a file of your disc. Doesn't matter gif or jpeg,
your call. I'm new to the list so don't have your e-mail address,
Thanks
Pat





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 13:06:00 -0400
Subject: Origami Foil Suppliers (review)

>+>I think finally the packagers/manufacturers have gotten the idea of
>+>selling paper in single color packages...

>+Really?  Please point me to one, because I haven't seen this, with the
>+exception of 15 cm gold or silver foils with a white paper side - yucky
>+enough (though plentiful) that I pretty much only use them for practice
>+folds.

>I have not seen it in any retail store where I live (Pittsburgh, PA,
>USA), but Fascinating Folds (http://www.fascinating-folds.com/), Kim's
>Crane (http://www.kimscrane.com/), and the OUSA Source
>(http://www.origami-usa.org/)all stock various sizes of paper that is
>packaged only one color per package.

Thanks for finally forcing me to go look at Fascinating Folds - they are the
only one of these suppliers that appears to be even trying to address the
needs of foil folders.  I will do business with them soon.

I got all the foil packages from OUSA in order to sample their offerings a
couple of months ago.  Every package is an assortment.  The American foils
are too thick for many high intermediate models, and the color on the foil
side tends to wear off while creasing much worse than the Japanese foils.

Scanning Kim's Crane's PDF just now, they appear to be just one step up from
OUSA in this department, in that they do offer a couple of single-color foil
choices, but nowhere near the selection of Fascinating Folds.

Usually I need instant gratification, and drive over to Sasuga, where they
generally have a few packages of 15 cm Japanese foils - which is the main
reason why I have learned to fold difficult models pretty small by most
people's standards (my Maekawa demons only stand about 1.5 inches tall, and
my Lang Cicada is lifesize, f'rexample).  They stock the gold and silver
backed with white, which are the thinnest, as well as color assortments,
which are slightly thicker, and assortments with a variety of colors on the
paper side, all being backed with silver, except for the red, which is
backed with gold.

So, while I feel a *little* foolish, the situation mostly still stands - if
you want to fold in foil, you apparently have only one reasonbly useful
source - Fascinating Folds.  And even they don't come anywhere close to the
level of choice I was describing as desirable in my last post.

-- Jim Puccio





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 13:15:19 -0400
Subject: Origami Foil Suppliers (review addition)

>They stock the gold and silver
>backed with white, which are the thinnest, as well as color assortments,
>which are slightly thicker, and assortments with a variety of colors on the
>paper side, all being backed with silver, except for the red, which is
>backed with gold.

I forgot to mention that this latter category is the thickest - good for
models at a level of complexity such as Engel's Valentine or Crawford's
Unicorn (but you've got to fold with tools - doing this is like metalwork),
but unwieldy for anything that bulks up much worse than those.

-- Jim Puccio





From: Manuel Nuno Alcada <nunoalca@MED.UP.PT>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 13:50:51 +0100
Subject: Re: Folded flying discs?

>I can send a scan of one of our discs as a jpeg or giff attachment to an
>email if anyone is interested. I hesitate attaching the scan to this
>message --- because it may be clutter to many.
>
>Martin R. Carbone

Please do you mind sending me the file

Thanks in advance

Manuel Nuno

_____________________________________________________________
Manuel Nuno de Magalhaes Pinheiro Alcada
Faculdade de Medicina do Porto
Servico de Bioquimica
Alameda Prof Hernani Monteiro
Porto
PORTUGAL
Tel: ...+2+5508838
Fax: ...+2+5510119
email: nunoalca@med.up.pt
_____________________________________________________________
"Nature to be commanded must be obbeyed"       Francis Bacon





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 14:02:31 -0400
Subject: Origami Foil Suppliers (addendum #2)

>The American foils
>are too thick for many high intermediate models, and the color on the foil
>side tends to wear off while creasing much worse than the Japanese foils.

Good examples of this are Max Hulme's bugs, of which, if you use the largest
sheet of American foil I could get (10"), and fold his simplest bug (the
Spider), by the time you're done, the legs will be pinstriped from the color
wear, and considerably bulkier and uglier than a model folded from the same
size Japanese foil, which actually turns out quite beautiful.  Heck, even
starting with a 15 cm Japanese square, you get a better result than with a
10" American piece.

And, in looking over Fascinating Folds' selection a little more carefully, I
see that most of the color choice they offer is in the American foils.
Bummer.

So in the final analysis, *nobody* offers much color choice at all in
Japanese foils.  Which isn't because the colors aren't manufactured - you do
get various colors in the assortments, but typically only two sheets of a
given color per pack.

This is really annoying, because

1) If you do difficult folds, you'll want to do the same fold over & over
again to really polish your styling on it; and I've found that practicing on
one material, then attempting a "final" version in another doesn't work very
well (f'rexample, practicing a piece on the plentiful Japanese gold foil,
then switching over to the thicker red/gold).  You want to practice in the
presentation material.  Not to mention that feeling that "this one will be a
final version" you keep getting as your styling gets closer & closer to your
vision of the piece.  This consumes a lot of stock.

2) Working on assemblages (like Yoshino's T-Rex skeleton) and modular unit
origami obviously consume stock like nobody's business.

I swear, this is a market opportunity for somebody.

-- Jim Puccio





From: Jorma Oksanen <tenu@SCI.FI>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 15:00:51 +0200
Subject: Re: Question about lightweight paper for wetfolding.

On 17-Sep-98, Carmine Di Chiara (cadichia@MIT.Edu) wrote:

>Would someone give me some advice on lighter papers suitable for
>wetfolding?

You could try Canson Kraft Couleur, 3x0.70m roll, 70g.  I remember seeing
it in black, yellow and red, but I can check if it's available in other
colors too.

You can forget wetfolding it though, it's only good for dampfolding :)

--
Jorma Oksanen   tenu@sci.fi

Weyland-Yutani - Building Better Worlds





From: Valerie Vann <valerie_vann@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 15:50:28 -0400
Subject: Origami Foil Suppliers (addendum #2)

<<Japanese foil color choices

Actually, this has gotten worse in last few years. I can use
the American foils for modulars (they're nice for that and
for boxes), but the Japanese foils are nice too. *AND*
they used to come in more colors in single packages (50sh),
at least 4-3/4 and 6 inch size, but all you can get now is
red, silver and gold.

Green used to be available at Christmas
time, but I couldn't even find that this year. And there was
a neat deep purple (another good "bug" color), but it was
discontinued over a year ago.

While, as noted, lots of great colors are *manufactured*, because
they turn up in the assorted packages, especially the mini-minis,
and even in assortments of duo paper/foil (paper one side,
foil on the back), though the latter is generally 6 inch sq at
largest, even heavier than American Foil, expensive, and
only one or two sheets of each per package. (So really only
good for boxes, and even that takes multiple packages.)

valerie





From: David Harter <tamagotchi@MINDSPRING.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 16:40:35 -0400
Subject: Re: Folded flying discs?

Martin,

I'd like the scan also!  Thanks!

David

Renata Fontenelle wrote:

> At 06:28 10/09/98 +0100, you wrote:
> >I have made adjustable indoor throwing discs out of cardstock for years ---
> >call them Flugels --- from the German word for fly. Can throw them about 50
> >feet.
> >
> >My designs require indenting, creasing and cutting. Does anyone know of a
> >design(s) for a Frisbee-like (somebody's trademark) throwing disc that does
> >not require cutting?
> >
> >I can send a scan of one of our discs as a jpeg or giff attachment to an
> >email if anyone is interested. I hesitate attaching the scan to this
> >message --- because it may be clutter to many.
>
> Hi, Martin.
>
> Would you mind sending me this scan?
> I'd appreciate it!
> Thanks a bunch,
> Renata





From: martin <mrcinc@SILCOM.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 19:12:30 +0100
Subject: Origami requires abstract thinking??

There is a standard mutiple-choice test I took 46 years ago which is the
"Minnesota Paperform Board Test" -- it shows flat diagrams for various
boxes and then shows five three-dimensional choices, asking which of the
five would result from folding the flat sheet.

The test has been said to measure the ability to think abstractly and to
reliably predict the success or failure as an Electrical Engineer. High
scores mean success.

My personal experience convinces me that the test is extremely accurate
with regard to the Electical Engineer part. I took the test as a college
freshman and scored in the twentieth percentile and was told not to try
Electrical Engineering, which was something I already knew, having studied
Electronics for 1000 hours in the Coast Guard and having been a failure as
an electronic technician. (I went on to some success as a Mechanical
Engineer, Product Developer and Businessman)

I would like to put forward the following questions for comments. Are any
of you origami enthusiasts familiar with the test? Have you taken it and
how did you score? And how can it possibly be explained that the ability to
visualize the flat diagrams in three dimensional form is related to
Electrical Engineering?

What human characteristics do you think the test measures and are those
characteristics abundant in those skilled in origami? Are there many
electrical engineers doing origami?

Martin R. Carbone
1227 De La Vina St.
Santa Barbara, CA 93101
Tel: 805-965-5574
Fax: 805-965-2414
email: mrcinc@silcom.com
Websites: http://www.modelshops.com <<<and>>> http://www.silcom.com/~mrcinc





From: martin <mrcinc@SILCOM.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 20:41:57 +0100
Subject: Paperform Board test

Jim Puccio said <<< In short, the test sounds wacky to me.>>>

Could be --- but it has a good pedigree, being developed by the Univ. Of
Minnesota and widely used for years in a battery of interest and aptitude
tests by universities. Has a good statistical background. Widely respected,
I believe, by professionals in the field of testing.

Martin R. Carbone
1227 De La Vina St.
Santa Barbara, CA 93101
Tel: 805-965-5574
Fax: 805-965-2414
email: mrcinc@silcom.com
Websites: http://www.modelshops.com <<<and>>> http://www.silcom.com/~mrcinc





From: Robert Vandeberg <rvandeberg@SPRYNET.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 22:10:09 -0600
Subject: Re: Folded flying discs?

Renata Fontenelle wrote:

> At 06:28 10/09/98 +0100, you wrote:
> >I have made adjustable indoor throwing discs out of cardstock for years ---
> >call them Flugels --- from the German word for fly. Can throw them about 50
> >feet.
> >
> >My designs require indenting, creasing and cutting. Does anyone know of a
> >design(s) for a Frisbee-like (somebody's trademark) throwing disc that does
> >not require cutting?
> >
> >I can send a scan of one of our discs as a jpeg or giff attachment to an
> >email if anyone is interested. I hesitate attaching the scan to this
> >message --- because it may be clutter to many.
>
> Hi, Martin.
>
> Would you mind sending me this scan?
> I'd appreciate it!
> Thanks a bunch,
> Renata

I also would enjoy receiving a copy of the diagrams.  Thankyou in advance.

--
PK





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 22:28:00 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami Foil Suppliers (addendum #2)

>Learn Japanese, join NOA (Nippon Origami Association), and order from their
>stock. Never say nobody until you've talked to everybody. 8)

Like I said, there's a market opportunity here.

-- Jim Puccio





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 22:52:33 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami Foil Suppliers (flogging that dead horse)

><<Japanese foil color choices

>Actually, this has gotten worse in last few years. [...]
>all you can get now is red, silver and gold.

And have you noticed how the red has kinda funky mechanical properties, like
it isn't completely metal, but seems to have some springy polymer in or on
it?  The stuff feels weird and doesn't hold its shape nearly as well as the
gold & silver.  Don't these manufacturers understand that the main point of
folding in foil isn't so much that it's *shiny*, but that it's *metal*?!?!?
To flog that dead horse just one last time, in my experience, foil folding,
when you do it a lot, feels less like a minor variant on kami folding than a
subgenre of metalwork.

Yeah, I know, there's always wet folding, but one doesn't always have the
ability to make a big mess.  Foil is about as sculptural in its own
characteristic way, neat, dry, and portable.  And you can make tiny
complicated things, which is fun in its own right.

-- Jim Puccio





From: DORIGAMI@AOL.COM
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 23:17:49 -0400 (
Subject: Re: Hi etc.

Patricia.....Welcome aboard to the journey of Origami....You're in for a
wonderful life.  Stick with it?  Try to start a group....Find people at the
library in your town..Advertise in the paper, ask around, teach a few people,
you"ll see, it doesnt take long.  Good luck, Dorigami





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 23:41:51 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami requires abstract thinking??

>The test has been said to measure the ability to think abstractly and to
>reliably predict the success or failure as an Electrical Engineer.

>I took the test as a college freshman and [...] was told not to try
>Electrical Engineering [...] (I went on to some success as a Mechanical
>Engineer, Product Developer and Businessman)

>And how can it possibly be explained that the ability to
>visualize the flat diagrams in three dimensional form is related to
>Electrical Engineering?

Good question, especially since it would make a whole lot more intuitive
sense for the test to be linked to physics, mechanical engineering (and its
pals, like ocean and civil), architecture, industrial design, computer
graphics, etc.  I'd guess geometers ought to excel, too.  And maybe even
draftsmen, graphic designers, type designers and photographers.  But, hey,
what do I know?

In short, the test sounds wacky to me.

>Are there many electrical engineers doing origami?

I got my Bachelor's degree from a EE department, but, though I had to learn
linear systems analysis, signal processing, and digital circuit design, it
was in reality a CS degree.  Later went to grad school to do CG in a lab
loosely associated with the architecture department (it has the hubris to
believe it is its own department!).  I make a living writing software,
usually CG or some related thing.

-- Jim Puccio





From: Douglas Zander <dzander@SOLARIA.SOL.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 23:46:55 -0500 (
Subject: Re: Paperform Board test

>
> Jim Puccio said <<< In short, the test sounds wacky to me.>>>
>
> Could be --- but it has a good pedigree, being developed by the Univ. Of
> Minnesota and widely used for years in a battery of interest and aptitude
> tests by universities. Has a good statistical background. Widely respected,
> I believe, by professionals in the field of testing.
>
>

 If you think that test is wacky, have you ever taken (IBM's) test
 to measure Computer Science Programming ability?    I believe it is IBM's
 but I'm not sure.   You get funny looking pictures that change from one to
 the next and then you've got to pick out the next picture in the series
 from a choice of several.

  1  - () -     2  = <> =    3  - [] -    4   = () =     5  - <> -     6  ?

 which is next?

  A  - [] -     B  - <> -    C  = [] =    D  = () =





From: Marc Kirschenbaum <marckrsh@PIPELINE.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 23:58:34 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami requires abstract thinking??

At 07:12 PM 9/17/98 +0100, martin <mrcinc@SILCOM.COM> wrote:
>
>I would like to put forward the following questions for comments. Are any
>of you origami enthusiasts familiar with the test? Have you taken it and
>how did you score? And how can it possibly be explained that the ability to
>visualize the flat diagrams in three dimensional form is related to
>Electrical Engineering?
>
>What human characteristics do you think the test measures and are those
>characteristics abundant in those skilled in origami? Are there many
>electrical engineers doing origami?

No, I have not taken the aforementioned test, but I did design a RISC
processor in school, and it worked flawlessly. The design process involved
woking with logical operator componenets, and creating a schematic that
would allow all of these parts to come together and form a more functional
whole. This is sort of like being able to see how the different sections of
a box can be brought up into a s-d formation to form a usefull container.
The obvious difference is that the latter problem is more visually
oriented. I have read how our visual perception is linked very closely to a
surprizingly large number of tasks that our brain performs. If a person can
perform something well on the visual level, it tends to follow that the
same person can follow on the more abstract logical level as well. Oh yeah,
I am not a neurologist either; I am in sales (finding jobs for computer
programmers). To relate to this topic, Cornell University's Archetectural
program had a special entrance examination at one time. They required that
the applicant design an origami model (some sort of geometric
construction). It is wild to thaing that a large number of us could have
gotten into that top univerity with some skills some of us take for granted.

Marc





From: "K.A. Lundberg" <klundber@MNSINC.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:24:12 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami requires abstract thinking??

Martin:
>There is a standard mutiple-choice test I took 46 years ago which is
the
>"Minnesota Paperform Board Test" -- it shows flat diagrams for
various
>boxes and then shows five three-dimensional choices, asking which of
the
>five would result from folding the flat sheet.

____________________
I remember this test.  It was a lot of fun.  It was the only ability
test I ever took where I didn't miss any of the questions.

Martin:
>The test has been said to measure the ability to think abstractly and
to
>reliably predict the success or failure as an Electrical Engineer.
High
>scores mean success.

_________________
This always confuzzeled me as I fail to grasp how a thought pattern is
anything but abstact <g>.  I don't know about Electrical
Engineering...not sure I could handle the math.

Martin:

>What human characteristics do you think the test measures and are
those
>characteristics abundant in those skilled in origami?

_____________________
I'm not sure what it measures outside of being able to fold boxes in
your mind.  Hey, some one needs to be able to do this, right?  And I
suppose it helps in origami, if the directions for a model are sparse
and you don't have anyone near to demonstrate the fold.

The only time this talent came in handy was working with electronic
databases.  It made visualizing how their internal structure worked
easier.

Kalei -- klundber@mnsinc.com





From: DLister891@AOL.COM
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:46:05 -0400 (
Subject: Re: CD-rom sur Neal Elias ?

In a message this morning Vincent wrote:

< Long time ago we talk about a cd-rom about Neal Elias.
 What is it status ? >

Dave Venables is still working actively on it. I visited him three weeks ago
and he had just returned from a holiday in Florida. While there, Neal Elias
joined him for a few days.

Dave made an audio tape of Neal answering questons put to him by various
people, including myself. He also made a video tape of Neal discoursing on
paperfolding.

I will be setting off this afternoon for Nottingham to attend the autumn
convention of the British Origami Society. I expect Dave to be there, so I
shall, no doubt learn more of his progress. But don't forget that there is a
lot of work in a CD-ROM.

Apart from that we will be celebrating the 100th birthday of Lillian (the
actual date of her birthday is 24th October), by releasing 100 red balloons,
each with an origami model attached. (We cribbed this idea from Origami
Deutschland.)

David Lister.





From: Bugly <amyg@AZSTARNET.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 04:58:36 -0700
Subject: Re: Hi etc.

(snip)
>Find people at the
>library in your town..Advertise in the paper, ask around, teach a few people,
>you"ll see, it doesnt take long.

Hmm...I've been folding for something like 8 years and have only met 3 other
people who do origami, and only currently have any kind of relationship with
one (I'm helping her find more complicated stuff).  As far as I know, there
are NO origami organizations here in Tucson, and all the the people I have
met were through other ways than the library...the selection there is really
poor anyway.

Is this just me, or am I really in an origami-less part of the world?

        Bugly





From: Vincent & Veronique <osele@MYGALE.ORG>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 06:40:03 +0200
Subject: CD-rom sur Neal Elias ?

Hello,

Long time ago :-) we talk about a cd-rom about Neal Elias.
What is it status ?

za+
Vincent

--
 _______  Osele Vincent (Toulouse/France) Membre du MFPP     _____
|       | osele@mygale.org                                  /|    |
|       | liste: origami-fr@listsrv.mygale.org             /_|    |
|       | http://www.mygale.org/~osele/origami.htm        |       |
|_______| -----------------> ORIGAMI -------------------> |_______|





From: Jane Rosemarin <jfrmpls@SPACESTAR.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:01:01 +0100
Subject: Re: Hi etc.

Pat asked:

>Is this just me, or am I really in an origami-less part of the world?

Another way to find fellow folders is to request a list from OrigamiUSA
of members in your area, whom you could contact. Once you have some small
number of OUSA members in your group, you can list it in the OUSA
newsletter, and attract anyone who joins OUSA after your group starts.

That's how Origami Minnesota got started. We have also found members at
demonstrations in the community.

You may not have joined OUSA yet. See their Internet site:
http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca/
for information.

About your question concerning origami websites, Joseph Wu's Origami Page
has links to diagrams and everything else you might want to know about
origami.

Have fun folding!

Jane





From: Jane Rosemarin <jfrmpls@SPACESTAR.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:10:21 +0100
Subject: Re: Hi etc.

Oops, I goofed on the website listings:

Joseph Wu's is:
http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca/

OrigamiUSA's is:
http://www.origami-usa.org

-Jane





From: martin <mrcinc@SILCOM.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:35:37 +0100
Subject: Re: Paperform Board test

Douglas Zander said -- <<<<...  If you think that test is wacky, have you
ever taken (IBM's) test to measure Computer Science Programming ability?
I believe it is IBM's but I'm not sure.   You get funny looking pictures
that change from one to the next and then you've got to pick out the next
picture in the series from a choice of several.

  1  - () -     2  = <> =    3  - [] -    4   = () =     5  - <> -     6  ?

 which is next?

  A  - [] -     B  - <> -    C  = [] =    D  = () = >>>>

This might not be origami related, but it does have to do with patterns and
puzzles1    qwa, which probably appeals to origami enthusiasts.

"What's next?" multiple choice tests are perhaps the most common of the
aptitude tests. I assume these tests measure your ability to reason
logically and find patterns and , perhaps to think creatively.

Was Douglas Zander's example an actual test question, or was it just a
symbolic example?

If it was symbolic only, it was a clever way of showing drawings by way of
the keyboard.
I could imagine that it would be possible to make a series of actual
questions of this type using the keyboard.

The easiest might be;
q - w - e - r - ?
1-l, 2-m, 3-c, 4-t, 5-b

Another easy one might be;
i - k - m - q - ?
1-t, 2-s, 3-r, 4-v, 5-u

Or (in fill-in form)
4-r-f-?
Or
4-$,m-M,b-B,;-?

Martin R. Carbone
1227 De La Vina St.
Santa Barbara, CA 93101
Tel: 805-965-5574
Fax: 805-965-2414
email: mrcinc@silcom.com
Websites: http://www.modelshops.com <<<and>>> http://www.silcom.com/~mrcinc





From: Ken Lehner <klehner@LUCENT.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:51:05 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami requires abstract thinking??

Marc Kirschenbaum wrote:
>
> At 07:12 PM 9/17/98 +0100, martin <mrcinc@SILCOM.COM> wrote:
> >
> >I would like to put forward the following questions for comments. Are any
> >of you origami enthusiasts familiar with the test? Have you taken it and
> >how did you score? And how can it possibly be explained that the ability to
> >visualize the flat diagrams in three dimensional form is related to
> >Electrical Engineering?

I took this test as part of the California Test (IIRC) in eighth grade.  I
scored in the 99th percentile.  I remember this so well, because we were
given our test results in algebra class, and we had to plot our scores on
the 5 or 6 test categories on a chart.  All I had to do was draw a straight
line through the 99s :-) :-) :-)

> >What human characteristics do you think the test measures and are those
> >characteristics abundant in those skilled in origami? Are there many
> >electrical engineers doing origami?

I think it measures your ability to "get your brain around" a problem.  You
need to manipulate an object in three dimensions without using your hands.
That means you can store the object in your head and move it around without
losing data.  This has come in quite handily when folding Lang's insects...

I have a degree in CS, and I've been reasonably successful in my 18 years
in the field.  The only person I know who also does origami has a CS degree,
too.

> To relate to this topic, Cornell University's Archetectural
> program had a special entrance examination at one time. They required that
> the applicant design an origami model (some sort of geometric
> construction). It is wild to thaing that a large number of us could have
> gotten into that top univerity with some skills some of us take for granted.

One of the reasons I went to Cornell was because I had an interest in
architecture.
Once I saw that the students in the School of Architorture (as it was known)
were
pulling at least one all-nighter a week, I abandoned that idea...

Ken Lehner





From: Renata Fontenelle <ren@NLINK.COM.BR>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:56:46 -0300
Subject: Origami supply shops in NYC

Hi all.

Could anyone in the NY area provide me with some addresses of origami
supplies stores in the area?
Thanks a bunch,
Renata





From: Ken Lehner <klehner@LUCENT.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 09:02:04 -0400
Subject: Dearth of Folders

Bugly wrote:

> Is this just me, or am I really in an origami-less part of the world?

I've been folding for about 30 years (in Pennsylvania, New York, Washington
and New Jersey), and I had never met anyone else who folds (who wasn't
introduced to origami by me) until I went to a local folding group last year.

Ken Lehner





From: Matthias Gutfeldt <tanjit@BBOXBBS.CH>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 09:17:44 +0200
Subject: Spacial thinking (was:Re: Origami requires abstract thinking?)

Martin R. Carbone writes about the Minnesota Paper Board test, and asks
whether anybody has done this test and how it relates to later success
-or failure- as an electrical engineer.

I've done this test several times in the past, I think, but I don't
remember any scores. I was probably bad at it.

All those psychological tests should be regarded with caution. In short,
a test like this one only tests how well you do in this specific test
environment. No abstract test can test directly how well you will do in
a certain profession. This box test does, I think, test your ability of
translating a two-dimensional plan into a three-dimensional object -you
have to do the transformation in your mind. This is one aspect of
abstract thinking, but only one aspect.

I'm not quite sure what job an electrical engineer does. We have a
biomedical engineer here; he plans and builds special prototypes of
biomedical wizardly gadgets. I do think the capability of translating a
flat diagram (e.g. the plan of the gadget itself, the wire-stuff, etc.)
to a three-dimensional object (the actual equipment) is rather important
for success. This ability of spacial thinking is important in many
professions, eg architecture; and also in Origami. If you simply can't
"see" the three-dimensional object in the flat diagrams, it is very
difficult to fold anything from diagram; but maybe it would be easy to
follow a live teacher?

I do think that for creating own designs, very good spacial thinking is
important; you can't create what you can't imagine. But for simply
following diagrams, like most of us do, the average spacial thinking
capabilities should do (and don't ask me how to measure degrees of the
capability of spacial thinking- there are such tests, I'm sure).

One more thing: I'll be on holidays for two weeks now, so I'll sign off
for that time. Till then, you can check out my own modest attempts at
writing two-dimensional plans of three-dimensional objects; there are a
few diagrams at my homepage, http://www.bboxbbs.ch/home/tanjit . The
sailboat is my very first diagram, and it shows :-). But I think my
diagramming skills improved over time.
You will notice that the first few models are all flat, and only one
model is truly three-dimensional. Makes you think about that spacial
thinking thing.

Comments, suggestions, etc. are welcome to my private e-mail address:
tanjit@bboxbbs.ch

Matthias





From: "Addiego, MIchael" <Michael.Addiego@US.SCHRODERS.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 09:33:57 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami supply shops in NYC

Renata,

        Pearl Paints tends to have origami papers.

Mike A

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Renata Fontenelle [SMTP:ren@NLINK.COM.BR]
> Sent: Friday, September 18, 1998 7:57 AM
> To:   ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject:      Origami supply shops in NYC
>
> ****** Please Note: This message came from the INTERNET. ******
>
> Hi all.
>
> Could anyone in the NY area provide me with some addresses of origami
> supplies stores in the area?
> Thanks a bunch,
> Renata

This message may contain privileged and confidential information.
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From: Mike and Janet Hamilton <Mikeinnj@CONCENTRIC.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 10:12:39 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami supply shops in NYC

>Could anyone in the NY area provide me with some addresses of origami
>supplies stores in the area?
>Thanks a bunch,
>Renata

Check my web page at http://www.concentric.net/~mikeinnj/orisrc.shtml

Janet Hamilton

mailto:Mikeinnj@concentric.net
http://www.concentric.net/~Mikeinnj





From: Mike and Janet Hamilton <Mikeinnj@CONCENTRIC.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 10:23:29 -0400
Subject: Paper wish list

The discussion of 20" kami, single color packages, and foil papers got me
started thinking about an origami paper wish list again.  Two things that I
would love to see are:

Packaged Kami in A4 size in the US

Packaged tissue foil, about 12" size (so it can be used full size or cut to
6")

I have so little time to actually fold, I don't want to lose time preparing
paper.  I also am very reluctant to cut the artisans papers I have bought -
I am always afraid of making that one wrong cut.  I'd like to see the
packaged tissue foil for one other reason - so I don't have to muck around
with the spray adhesives or similar chemicals.

By the way, I never saw the paper board test being discussed, but took
something similar in 7th grade which the schools used to decide who got to
start algrbra a year early.  I did well on the test, but was just about
failing algebra in 8th grade until all of a sudden it just clicked.  I've
aced all math and computer courses since.

>>     1  - () -     2  = <> =    3  - [] -    4   = () =     5  - <> -
6  ?
>>
>>which is next?
>>
>>  A  - [] -     B  - <> -    C  = [] =    D  = () =

And since no one has answered yet, the answer is C.

Janet Hamilton

mailto:Mikeinnj@concentric.net
http://www.concentric.net/~Mikeinnj





From: martin <mrcinc@SILCOM.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 11:25:35 +0100
Subject: Papershops website

You are invited to visit papershops .com. Went online this week. The items
of most interest to Origami enthusiasts are at
<<<http://www.papershops.com/techniques.html>>>.

You will find some information on Boxmaking, Cardstock Medallions and
Flying Discs (layout and instructions you can download free) and a request
for Origami Projects. Roam around on the site and you will find some
cardstock and tools for sale. The site is skimpy now --- but we hope to get
it fleshed out in due course. We are trying to become a deep and
comprehensive source for Papercrafting Tools, Materials and Information.

Advice, comments and criticism (good or bad) are invited

Martin R. Carbone
1227 De La Vina St.
Santa Barbara, CA 93101
Tel: 805-965-5574
Fax: 805-965-2414
email: mrcinc@silcom.com
Websites: http://www.modelshops.com <<<and>>> http://www.silcom.com/~mrcinc





From: Douglas Zander <dzander@SOLARIA.SOL.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 11:29:35 -0500 (
Subject: Re: Paperform Board test

>
> Was Douglas Zander's example an actual test question, or was it just a
> symbolic example?
>

 It was just a silly example, not really meant to be hard, just to give an
 idea of what the test is like.  These tests are actually kinda fun!

--
 Douglas Zander                |
 dzander@solaria.sol.net       |
 Shorewood, Wisconsin, USA     |





From: Douglas Zander <dzander@SOLARIA.SOL.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 11:44:23 -0500 (
Subject: Re: Paperform Board test

>
> I could imagine that it would be possible to make a series of actual
> questions of this type using the keyboard.
>
> The easiest might be;
> q - w - e - r - ?
> 1-l, 2-m, 3-c, 4-t, 5-b
>
> Another easy one might be;
> i - k - m - q - ?
> 1-t, 2-s, 3-r, 4-v, 5-u
>
> Or (in fill-in form)
> 4-r-f-?
> Or
> 4-$,m-M,b-B,;-?
>

 I forgot to mention that this test is *not* a 'series' test.  Your example
 above is IMO not correct.  Your making a series out of letters and/or numbers.
 The test I was refering to shows an abstract *picture* that has a specific
 change go through it from one picture to the next and the examinee must
 determine what the change(s) are and how it will affect the last picture
 given.  An example would be a picture composed of boxes, circles,
 triangles, and other shapes that become distorted or colored in or rotated
 either as a whole or as separate components.  Please understand this is not
 a flame of your example, I'm just clearifying what I meant by this
 programmer's test.

--
 Douglas Zander                |
 dzander@solaria.sol.net       |
 Shorewood, Wisconsin, USA     |





From: Jeannine Mosely <j9@CONCENTRA.COM>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 14:53:45 -0400
Subject: Re: Flying things

A couple of people asked for a description of my business card flying
star.  I have a feeling I may have described it the list before, but I
don't remember for sure.  Here is a really hasty description.  If it
doesn't make any sense, I'm sorry.

Here is a quick description of the flying star.  Starting with a
rectangle in the proportions 4:7, valley fold one of the diagonals.
Orient the crease to be horizontal, so that the card looks like a pair
of mountains, one in the foreground and one behind it.  Make a
perpendicular valley fold through the peak (corner) of the front
mountain and a perpendicular mountain fold through the peak (corner)
of the rear mountain.  Assemble by hooking a "flap" on one card over
the "mountain slope" of its neighbor, and vice-versa.  Go around in a
ring until cards are locked.  This one holds together well.  Throw as
you would a Frisbee.

I am going on a week long vacation starting Sunday (SEOF in
Charlotte!), so I won't be available to answer questions till the
28th.

        -- Jeannine Mosely





From: tommy <tomkat@DALLAS.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 17:38:45 -0500
Subject: Re: Flying things

Jeannine Mosely wrote:
>
> A couple of people asked for a description of my business card flying
> star.  I have a feeling I may have described it the list before, but I
> don't remember for sure.  Here is a really hasty description.  If it
> doesn't make any sense, I'm sorry.

Here is Jeannine's original post with a couple of ascii diagrams from
4/17/97. I have folded this model and like it. Throwing it like a
Frisbee produces a quick flight of about 15 feet then a sudden nose dive
kind of like a sinking pitch in baseball.

Tommy

origami-l message body

Body:

Here's a simple 6 pointed origami star that can be made from 6 American
business cards (2" x 3.5").  Cards in other proportions will not work.
Fold the card along it's long diagonal, to formw hat looks like two
mountain peaks.

                 / \        / \
                /     \  /     \
               /      /         \
              /    /             \
             /  /                 \
             ----------------------

Add two vertical creases from the peaks of the mountains down to the
long diagonal.  The left fold is a mountain fold, the right one is a
valley.  Hook the flap at the right over the corresponding edge of
another such unit placed under it, rotated 60 degrees.  The second unit
underneath will also have a flap that can be hooked over an edge of the
unit on top.

                     edge |
                          V
                 /|\        /|\
                / *   \  /     \
               /  |   /      |  \  <-- flap
              /   */             \
             /  / |          |    \
             ----------------------

                   -- Jeannine Mosely





From: Douglas Zander <dzander@SOLARIA.SOL.NET>
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 18:08:23 -0500 (
Subject: Re: Flying things: The Next Generation :-)

Jeannine Mosely gave a description of her six-pointed flying frisbee using
six business cards of 4:7 proportions.  I was just fooling around with the
dimensions and found that by following her folding method almost exactly,
one can make a four-pointed star/flying frisbee.  Here is my describtion:

Use 4 business cards or pieces of paper each in proportion of 1:sqrt(3)
Fold each along a diagonal.  Use the same diagonal for each piece.
You will have two mountains so to speak, one in front and one behind.
Valley fold the forward mountain *along the bisector* of the mountain;
do not fold perpendicular along the bottom edge but rather fold the
mountain in half, the slopes of the mountain will meet together.
Mountain fold the rear mountain in half along its bisector also.
Assemble as you did with the six-pointed frisbee/star but this time
you will only need four modules forming a four-pointed star.

--
 Douglas Zander                |
 dzander@solaria.sol.net       |
 Shorewood, Wisconsin, USA     |





From: Howard Portugal <howardp@FAST.NET>
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 1998 00:45:20 -0400
Subject: Re: Flying things: The Next Generation :-)

Doug,

Could you elaborate a bit more on the assembly method? I tried both Jeannine's
6 and your 4, and hers went together fine with the last unit mating with the
first one. But I can't seem to link the first and last ones using your units.
Any idea what's wrong?

Howard

Douglas Zander wrote:

> Jeannine Mosely gave a description of her six-pointed flying frisbee using
> six business cards of 4:7 proportions.  I was just fooling around with the
> dimensions and found that by following her folding method almost exactly,
> one can make a four-pointed star/flying frisbee.  Here is my describtion:
>
> Use 4 business cards or pieces of paper each in proportion of 1:sqrt(3)
> Fold each along a diagonal.  Use the same diagonal for each piece.
> You will have two mountains so to speak, one in front and one behind.
> Valley fold the forward mountain *along the bisector* of the mountain;
> do not fold perpendicular along the bottom edge but rather fold the
> mountain in half, the slopes of the mountain will meet together.
> Mountain fold the rear mountain in half along its bisector also.
> Assemble as you did with the six-pointed frisbee/star but this time
> you will only need four modules forming a four-pointed star.
>
> --
>  Douglas Zander                |
>  dzander@solaria.sol.net       |
>  Shorewood, Wisconsin, USA     |

--
Howard Portugal, West Chester, PA email:howardp@fast.net
---------------------------------------------------
"A problem worthy of attack, proves its worth by fighting back."
Author Unknown





From: Valerie Vann <valerie_vann@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 1998 10:50:37 -0400
Subject: Re: Hi etc.

The URL Jane gives is for Joseph Wu's
site, not OUSA, tho Joseph has links
to the various national organization sites.

valerie





From: Douglas Zander <dzander@SOLARIA.SOL.NET>
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 1998 17:51:59 -0500 (
Subject: Re: Flying things: The Next Generation :-)

>
> Doug,
>
> Could you elaborate a bit more on the assembly method? I tried both Jeannine's
> 6 and your 4, and hers went together fine with the last unit mating with the
> first one. But I can't seem to link the first and last ones using your units.
> Any idea what's wrong?
>
> Howard
>

  I am sorry!  I am wrong!  I actually do not know the exact proportions!
  They definitly are *not* 1 : square root of 3   or   1 : 1.73205
  What had happened was this:
  I had made a 4 pointed star and it was a little tight and needed fudging
  to get it together.  I had ASSUMED that I had used paper that was close
  to 1:sqrt(3) and that what I needed was perfectly cut paper that was
  closer to these dimensions.  Just now I took apart my one and only 4
  pointed star and actually *measured* the dimensions and whoops!  they
  were no where near 1:sqrt(3) in dimension.  The actual paper dimension
  that I had used was 6:14  *but* it still will be a little tight and needs
  fudging.  Can anyone come up with the actual dimensions using geometry?
  Sorry everyone!

--
 Douglas Zander                |
 dzander@solaria.sol.net       |
 Shorewood, Wisconsin, USA     |





From: Judy D Pagnusat <judypag@JUNO.COM>
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 1998 20:21:42 -0700
Subject: Re: Reproducibility of origami.

On Mon, 14 Sep 1998 13:25:44 -0400 Chrome Digital
<chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET> writes:
>>The question that occurred t me is why is it that some art works like
>>music, origami or architecture have "written" instructions like sheet
>>music, diagrams and blueprints and are therefore reproducible, and
>>others like paintings, sculptures or films are not?
>
>I believe this has to do with how easily mathematizable the art form
>in
>question is; i.e. how easily represented using the mechanisms of lower
>mathematics - e.g. the simpler algebras and geometries, since anything
>requiring too much work to decode will not be able to be "sight read,"
>and
>would probably end up as a data representation for a digital medium
>instead,
>if in the final analysis, anyone paid any attention to the system at
>all!
>For example, in dance there are notations - Labanotation and Benesh
>spring
>to mind, but virtually none of the dancers one meets in real life have
>ever
>heard of them.  Sometimes these things just don't go over particularly
>well.

I believe there are two directions you can come to origami from,
scientific/mathmatical and art/visual.  Believe me if we were to come to
this art purely from a math perspective, I wouldn't be here!

Judy

>Just my two bits worth,
>
>-- Jim Puccio
>

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From: Wayne Fluharty <wflu@HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 04:46:42 -0700 (
Subject: Origami sighting

In the current issue of "Reader's Digest" (October 1998) in the "Campus
Comedy" section (a section where people send in humorous things that
have happened to them at college/school) is the following article:

   Because of its intensity, organic chemistry has long been known as
the "weed out" course at the University of Maryland. One day, for a
change of pace, my professor distributed filter papers for us to
practice folding for our lab. After detailed instructions and variuos
folds, however, our fluted papers didn't quite match the instructor's.
Dismayed, I leaned over and asked my friend, "What is this?"
   He replied, "Origami chemistry."

Wayne "Flu" Fluharty
wflu@hotmail.com

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From: Dennis Walker <d_and_m_walker@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 05:36:02 -0400
Subject: Origami Sighting

Hello,

        In this week's 'Radio Times'  (dated 19-25 September) there is an
advert on p21 for a company selling roof windows that has a paper aeroplane
prominently shown. It is not the paper dart. I recognise the model but
can't name it I'm afraid.

                                        Dennis





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 13:12:46 -0400
Subject: Re: Reproducibility of origami.

>>I believe this has to do with how easily mathematizable the art form
>>in question is; i.e. how easily represented using the mechanisms of lower
>>mathematics - e.g. the simpler algebras and geometries

>I believe there are two directions you can come to origami from,
>scientific/mathmatical and art/visual.  Believe me if we were to come to
>this art purely from a math perspective, I wouldn't be here!

Right!  That's exactly why it seems that notational systems have to be based
on *lower* mathematics - so that artists can deal with them on a pretty
intuitive level, without necessarily *knowing* that they are even using a
mathematical system!

I kinda doubt that we'll be seeing splines used to broaden the origami
diagramming vocabulary, for example, even though I bet there's some way you
*could* apply the de Casteljau subdivision algorithm to making
curve-and-surface-approximating folds.  It just wouldn't go over.  (Don't
worry if you have no idea what I just said - that's actually my point!)

There's also that issue of how much the notation abstracts away from the
actual art performance experience.  I think Labanotation and Benesh have
been more or less failures in the dance world because they fail to capture
most of the subtlety available to the kinaesthetic artist.  Origami
diagramming does reasonably well - up to a point - and the point at which it
breaks down (judgement folds, 3D surface sculpting, mindbending 3D kinematic
processes that exceed Yoshizawa's written vocabulary, etc.) are sufficiently
advanced that it doesn't impede the art any more than the notational
problems with 20th century Western art music (see, for example, Cage's
wonderful compendium "Notations"), Anthony Braxton's jazz compositions,
Hendrix guitar solos, or whatever.

In violent agreement,

-- Jim Puccio





From: Dorothy Engleman <FoldingCA@WEBTV.NET>
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 13:18:50 -0700
Subject: Re: Reproducibility of origami

Jim Puccio wrote:

"I think Labanotation and Benesh have been more or less failures in the
dance world because they fail to capture most of the subtlety available
to the kinaesthetic artist."

Is it not the performing artist who is charged with capturing the
subtleties of the art and recreating the artist's intentions?

Music, dance and origami are not static art forms. Each performing
artist should be expected to bring a unique and dynamic interpretation
to the original art.

Though the pianist, Artur Rubinstein, defined for me the gold standard
of Chopin performance, I still appreciate the inifinite interpretive
variety offered by other pianists.

Similarly, I find it highly instructive and enjoyable to see how
different paperfolders interpret and represent the same model.





From: Chrome Digital <chromedigi@EARTHLINK.NET>
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 13:34:23 -0400
Subject: Origami hearing

What with all these sightings, I figure it's about time that someone mention
what may be the first instance of origami cropping up in music - the current
hit single by the band "Eve 6" (don't know the song title... sorry), has
among its lyrics "... my origami, fold it up and just pretend ..."

Know of any others?

-- Jim Puccio





From: Mike and Janet Hamilton <Mikeinnj@CONCENTRIC.NET>
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 18:19:15 -0400
Subject: Re: Origami hearing

>What with all these sightings, I figure it's about time that someone
mention
>what may be the first instance of origami cropping up in music - the
current
>hit single by the band "Eve 6" (don't know the song title... sorry), has
>among its lyrics "... my origami, fold it up and just pretend ..."

Artist & song - Eve6, Inside out; Lyrics at
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Shores/5446/insideout.html
Or am I origami, folded up and just pretend. Demented as the motives in
your head...

Janet Hamilton

mailto:Mikeinnj@concentric.net
http://www.concentric.net/~Mikeinnj





From: Nick Robinson <nick@CHEESYPEAS.DEMON.CO.UK>
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 18:20:53 +0100
Subject: Nottingham BOS convention

Just returned from the Notty BOS weekend - the usual mixture of
chatting, folding & relaxing. I'll leave full reports to others, but
would like to mention there's a photo at the BOS web-site of the launch
of 100 balloons for Lillian Oppenheimer, a tribute we borrowed from
Origami Deutschland. Check the gallery.....

all the best,

Nick Robinson

email           nick@cheesypeas.demon.co.uk
homepage        http://www.cheesypeas.demon.co.uk - all new look!
BOS homepage    http://www.rpmrecords.co.uk/bos/
RPM homepage    http://www.rpmrecords.co.uk - now with RealAudio clips!
