




Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:56:03 -0500
From: Bernie Cosell <bernie@FANTASYFARM.COM>
Subject: Re: (NO) Message timing
Priority: normal
Comments: To: Origami Mailing List <Origami@MIT.EDU>

On 25 Feb 98 at 11:37, Joseph Wu wrote:

> >It's interesting how I receive messages from the "new"
> >listserver. I do not subscribe to the list in digest form.
> >With the previous listserver, I received the messages
> >in chronological order. Now the messages are not
> >in consecutive order....
> >
> >hmmm... just interesting since now I really am not
> >able to read the messages in order....
>
> This software seems to take the message date at face value, so if a
> member's computer has the date (or even the time zone) set up improperly,
> that's the date that the message gets stamped with. I'll see if we can
> change that so that the messages are stamped with the delivery date.

This doesn't sound right.  There's no reason for the server to mess with the
'Date' field in the messages --- it should just leave them.  As for delivery
order, the dates on the messages have nothing to do with all that, if I
understand his problem: he's not *receiving* them in the right order, which is
a transmission problem.

He can learn a lot about these sorts of problems by expanding headers on the
messages he receives: he should see them time stamped at MIT in chronological
order [that is, the order they were received at MIT] and the next time stamp
[the one that comes -before- that one in the headers -- time stamps go in
reverse order] will be when MIT managed to deliver the message to his mail
server.  It is fair to assume that the servers have their timezone and clocks
set properly, so you ought to be able to make sense out of the time sequence
even if the user bollixed the 'Date' when they composed the message.

Note that MIT has a rather complicated mail system, and so any slight internal
glitch can hold up some mail while it lets other stuff through.  Your message,
for example, is stamped:

[.. many more stamps...]
Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:19:00 -0500 Received: from MITVMA.MIT.EDU by MITVMA.MIT.EDU
 (LISTSERV release 1.8c) with
          NJE id 1706 for ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:19:33
          -0500
[..more stamps..]

We can see that MIT received the message from Joseph's system at 14:49..
They forwarded it to MITVMA [which is the actual system running the listserver]
right away, but that system sat on it for half an hour before it continued on
its path to me.  But once MITVMA forwarded the message on, it took less than a
minute for it to get to me.

I received two messages at essentially the same time [the other from Lisa] and
I note that her message arrived at MIT about five minutes before Joseph's, but
they both got sent out at the same time, so it might well be that MIT is doing
some kind of 'batch' processing for the mail server and it might well result in
messages ending up out of order more often than when they were sent out closer
to 'as received'...

If you get some stuff in that you think is out of chronological order, you can
do this same sort of thing: peek at the 'Received-by' headers and see which
server along the way juggled the order of the messages.

  /Bernie\
--
Bernie Cosell                     Fantasy Farm Fibers
mailto:bernie@fantasyfarm.com     Pearisburg, VA
    -->  Too many people, too few sheep  <--





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:58:18 -0500
From: Daddy-o D'gou <dwp+@TRANSARC.COM>
Subject: Re: (NO) Message timing

Joseph Wu indited:
> This software seems to take the message date at face value, so if a
> member's computer has the date (or even the time zone) set up improperly,
> that's the date that the message gets stamped with. I'll see if we can
> change that so that the messages are stamped with the delivery date.

If I may say, that is how the old system worked, so it was impossible to
tell how long it took for a message to be delivered.  Paranoia aside, it
seemed to me that when I put a tag line on my email stating when I had
sent it, it would come back to me in a few hours or less, though many
times I would get a response via the list before I would see my own
message!  It would be nice if you could preserve the original time stamp
in the message though.

-D'gou

--
end
<a href="http://www.pgh.net/~dwp">Doug's Fun Page</a>





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:04:37 -0500
From: Daddy-o D'gou <dwp+@TRANSARC.COM>
Subject: Re: Help for the Orchid Flower Model

Jurgen Pletinckx indited:

> Ah, exactly how many tries are we talking about here? (Long, long break
> as Jurgen puts his fingers where his mouth is, or somesuch, and tries
> folding from a 10 cm square.) Egad, this actually works on the first try.

See, not so bad!

> My, I could get to like this. Paper didn't even tear, as I thought it would.
> Still suffering from Paper Plasticity Syndrome, of course.

Interesting.  I know Joseph Wu (and probably others) have written in the
past about how their hands impart moisture to the paper as they fold, so
the longer you have to spend folding, the damper the paper gets.
Personally, I find my hands are very dry, so that when I wet fold I have
to be careful to keep my hands moist so that the paper I'm working most
on doesn't dry out too fast!  (That is a pain up until the very final
shaping where it comes in, ah, handy).

> | Not to cast a Shadow on this wonderful model, but I have had many people
> | ask me what it was. ...
>
> I can blame the folder for that :)

Nice try, but BZZZZT!  Orchid species and varieties differ in physical
appearance WAY more than, say, roses do.

-D'gou
--
end
<a href="http://www.pgh.net/~dwp">Doug's Fun Page</a>





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:12:51 -0500
From: Jeff Kerwood <jkerwood@USAOR.NET>
Subject: Re: Neale vs.. Stamm Dragon

Thanks to Michael J. Naughton, Charles Knuffke, Carole Young and those that
replied to me privately.  Many good ideas and tips. Florists foil - I went
to four florists but couldn't get it (I would try to get some from FF but
I'm running short on time to get these done). I did however already have
some aquarium foil (the same thing as far as I can  tell by your
descriptions), it really worked great. Foil backed tissue - I made and
tried some, that worked great too. Paper backed foil - I tried some
thickish gold paper backed foil (Solid Solids from Michael's), also
terrific. So I went from not knowing what to do to having three great
papers, a problem I can deal with. Thanks to all of you.

========================

I do have to have a talk Carole:

> Lawdy I hope you don't kill me, but I would try helping it out with
> Post-it Glue sticks.  Art spray is good.  For serious preserving I use
> casting plastic and a paint brush and work fast.

Ohhhhhh MYYYYY!!!!  Not that I would consider doing it, but how would you
use the Post-it Glue stick, to affix it to a base? hold pieces of it to
each other? or what?   What is "casting plastic"?

=======================

Thanks, Jeff
jkerwood@usaor.net





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:34:09 -0500
From: Jeff Ellis <ellis7@EROLS.COM>
Subject: Re: origami and family traditions

Lucille Dan wrote:

> To Ria Sutter:
> Paper folding is not a tradition in my family, but as a child I was
> taught by
> my ?father to fold a sailboat from a rectangle of paper. It had
> several steps
> to it, but the first folds formed a sort of sailboat/party pirate hat.
> When
> it was further developed, it turned into a compact floatable ship.
> It's interesting (to me, at least) that in the 2 years that I've been
> folding
> I've never seen this model anywhere.
> Lucille Dan

It is funny that your first model with a sailboat/party pirate hat.
That was also the first model that I learned, and got me very inturested
in Origami.  I learned it in a summer camp.  I too have never seen it
published.
Jeff





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:38:00 -0800 (PST)
From: Marcia Mau <maumoy@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: MFPP Convention
Comments: To: origami@MIT.EDU

Does anyone have information about the location, registration, &
accommodations for the MFPP Convention?  All I know so far is it will be
in Paris from May 21st to 24th.

This convention coincides with the 10th Anniversary of ELFA, the
Envelope and Letterfold Assn.  I'm planning to attend but I'd like to
have some specifics before I book my flight.

Thanks.

Marcia Mau
Vienna, VA USA

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:15:09 +0000
From: John Smith <jon.pure@PASTON.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: Postscript diagrams

At 12:31 AM 2/24/98 +0800, you wrote:
>There is a  small program (303kb) on the net now for viewing Postscript
>files in Windows called RoPS

I have down loaded the 32 bit version and it is a very fast and very good
program. I successfully printed
a sample page of Robert Lang's Peacock. I failed , however with Joseph Wu's
Crystal, all of the pages appeared
were superimposed. This may be because it is a type 1 postscript.

The 32 bit version is over 700,000 bytes in Zip form and you have 21 days in
which to examine it. The cost of
one copy is 30 pounds.

John Smith
Norwich
England
e-mail  jon.pure@paston.co.uk





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:31:13 +0100
From: jpl@WWW.BARCLAB.COM
Subject: Re: Help for the Orchid Flower Model

Doug Philips stated :

| Yay!  Don't worry, that gets easier.  And you'll find that you can
| streamline the folding sequence some versus the printed diagrams.  Then
| you'll find (if you keep folding it), that you can do it from 3"
| paper).  I haven't tried any smaller paper than that (3" I carry with me
| anytime I have a pocket).

Ah, exactly how many tries are we talking about here? (Long, long break
as Jurgen puts his fingers where his mouth is, or somesuch, and tries
folding from a 10 cm square.) Egad, this actually works on the first try.

My, I could get to like this. Paper didn't even tear, as I thought it would.
Still suffering from Paper Plasticity Syndrome, of course.

| Not to cast a Shadow on this wonderful model, but I have had many people
| ask me what it was. ...

I can blame the folder for that :)

--
 Jurgen Pletinckx                           BARC         Etre une heure, rien
 Tel +32 9 220 49 81         Fax +32 9 221 85 17         qu'une heure durant
 jpl@barclab.com                                         Beau, beau, beau
 Industriepark Zwijnaarde 7, B9052 Gent, Belgium         et con a la fois





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:49:44 -0500
From: STEVE179 <STEVE179@IX.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Introduction to the internet...

I ran and got it and I heartily agree! It's great ! And it's only about
760K zipped up.

----------
> From: Bernie Cosell <bernie@FANTASYFARM.COM>
> To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject: Re: Introduction to the internet...
> Date: Monday, February 16, 1998 9:39 PM
>
> On 16 Feb 98 at 16:13, Wayne Fluharty wrote:
>
> > Where can I find _____:
> > Once again, use the search engines. I searched for "+origami +used"
once
> > and found a copy of Harbin's "Origami" for $2.00. ...
>
> Let me let you folks in on something that completely changed the
> complexion of the web for me [and those of you who know some about me
> know that I ain't no novice, so that's *really* saying something].  If
> you're running Win95, run, don't walk, to http://www.ferretsoft.com and
> download "webferret".  It is -free- and it is the single most useful web
> utility I've run into before or since.  Trust me: it will change forever
> how you find things on the web and how useful the web is as a resource.
>
>   /Bernie\
> --
> Bernie Cosell                     Fantasy Farm Fibers
> mailto:bernie@fantasyfarm.com     Pearisburg, VA
>     -->  Too many people, too few sheep  <--





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 21:39:27 -0500
From: Sheldon Ackerman <ackerman@DORSAI.ORG>
Subject: Orchid

>28. Double sink using already existing creases: insert your finger from the
>top and form a pyramid starting from the base as you symmetrically separate
>the inner layers two by two.
OK...I did the double sink. As far as I know I did it correctly. Looking at
diagram 28, I took the
lower horizontal line to be a valley fold and the upper one a mountain fold.
At diagram 28  my model is flat and symmetrical. After I complete the double
sink, it is still flat
and symmetrical. In other words, I recreased the model along the existing
folds after the double
sink. (Continued after 29 below :-)

>29. View from the top - the square represents the hollow base of the four-
>sided pyramid; pinch the top of the pyramid in rder to give a triangular
>form to the base (suggested by the dashes). Insert your finger in point a
>to form the <corolla/petal shell>. Point c should move towards the front to
>form the <pistil/carpel>.
>Jurgen Pletinckx
I have no 4 sided pyramid as it is folded flat. Yes, I can open it and try
to form a square. Is that
what I should do? The pyramid as I have it would form an octagon if opened
and view from the
top of the model.

Or did I do the double sink in correctly?

---
Sheldon Ackerman.......http://www.dorsai.org/~ackerman/
ackerman@dorsai.org
sheldon_ackerman@fc1.nycenet.edu





Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 22:57:09 -0500
From: Valerie Vann <valerie_vann@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Subject: (NO): Links from Joseph Wu's Web page

I hadn't checked out Joseph Wu's web page in over a month,
due to multiple projects, work and a bunch of work related
computer matters. Well, I discovered first hand what some
members of the origami-L were talking about when they said
they couldn't open any of the links from Joseph's pages.

Using AmericaOnLine version 3.5 for Win3.x, with its old
"native" well behaved built in browser, I visited Joseph's site.

After opening the top page, I jumped to the USA links list
to see what was new, and tried a couple of links, including
the ones to my own pages.

Each generated an error message that the link could not be
opened, "possibly due to network traffic".

So I switched to Compuserve with Microsoft Internet Explorer
v. 3.01 for Win3.x. I transferred to the South American link
list OK, but attempts to open individual links produced a more
informative error message: "Your software does not have the
necessary protocol to process cgi script such-and-such" (the
cgi script that handles the link.)

Then my attempt to switch to the USA link page resulted in a
crash of Explorer, followed by a crash of Win3.11 Program manager,
followed by a cold boot.

Granted, the AOL browser is a little antiquated, but it can handle
the kind of secure transaction server than Amazon.com used, and
it doesn't take up my entire hard drive, keeps all its stuff in
its own directories, and doesn't try to take control of my life
like some software does.

Similarly, Explorer 3.01 (Compuserve version) works quite nicely
99% of the time, and I refuse to upgrade either one of these
installations to MSIExplorer4 because every installation I've
done of that (and I'm my company's computer person) has resulted
in a collossal mess and waste of time, and Navigator is only
slightly better.

I know from email and conversations that I'm not the only one of
AOL's 10 million members, or of Compuserves 2 million, who is
not using the latest and greatest whiz bang operating system
and browser for similar reasons or because their hardware won't
support them.

How about a nice alternate plain old standard HTML page with
ordinary vanilla links for "the rest of us" so we can get
"where we want to go today", Joseph?

Valerie Vann





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 06:45:24 -0800
From: mSaliers <saliers@CONCENTRIC.NET>
Subject: Re: (NO): Links from Joseph Wu's Web page

>
> How about a nice alternate plain old standard HTML page with
> ordinary vanilla links for "the rest of us" so we can get
> "where we want to go today", Joseph?
>

Hear! Hear!  When I try to open the main page in Netscape 3.0,
the dragon comes up as a jigsaw puzzle.  Then the browser
crashes.  I really don't want to upgrade to IE 4.0 just
to view one page.  Bring back the HTML!

Mark





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 07:02:24 +0100
From: Sebastian Marius Kirsch <skirsch@T-ONLINE.DE>
Subject: Re: Postscript diagrams

On Wed, 25 Feb 1998, John Smith wrote:
> The 32 bit version is over 700,000 bytes in Zip form and you have 21
> days in which to examine it. The cost of one copy is 30 pounds.

Well, if you consider that Aladdin GhostScript is free for non-commercial
applications, and that it is a full-featured PostScript Level 2
interpreter (Peter Deutsch is already adding the Level 3 stuff, I
believe), that it has got a load of utilities for converting PostScript to
PDF, EPSF, AI etc., this might be worth the little effort of getting the
files and installing them.

And do consider that most of the files in the archives are PostScript
Level 2, whereas RoPS can only handle PostScript Level 1.

Yours, Sebastian                                       skirsch@t-online.de
                        /or/ sebastian_kirsch@kl.maus.de (no mail > 16KB!)





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 07:16:16 -0800
From: John Sutter <sutterj@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: origami enthusiast survey

Hi Origamians,

My curiosity about origami history and interest in how much the art of paper
folding has spread and by
whom has led me to pose the following questions to list members:

     1) Who or What got you interested in learning origami?
     2) Was it a solitary pursuit or a collaaborative effort?
     3) Do you do it as a hobby?
     4) Did you learn it as a child?
     5) What models do you remember from childhood and are they commonly
found basic origami books?
     6) Do you teach it to groups formally or informally?
     7) Are you a professional who makes a living from origami books,
workshops etc.? I recognize some names
like Joseph Wu in this category and I hope they will respond.
     8) Have you done family oriented workshops?
     9) Do you think origami could become as popular in America as it has
become in Japan or do you think
most Americans are too impatient?  ( I find many kids and adults don't have
long enough attention spans to
go beyond basic origami)
    10) I think it could be a good family activity if young parents could be
turned on to the fun, educational
and cultural benefits-What do you think?

My original interest was to find out whether members might have learned
origami from parents or other family
members, as it has been done in Japan and other Asian countries.  I expected
most responses from Asian
Americans, Latin Americans, Anglicans,and people of Arab ancestry to respond
because of what I've read on
the history of origami.  I expect that computers and the information age
will change the history of paper
folding and speed its popularity across the world.

Thanks in advance to anybody who takes the time to respond,
Ria Sutter





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 07:54:42 -0600
From: Tom Hill <tomh@GROUPWORKS.COM>
Subject: Re: Orchid

<snip>

> At diagram 28  my model is flat and symmetrical. After I complete the double
> sink, it is still flat
> and symmetrical. In other words, I recreased the model along the existing
> folds after the double
> <snip>

> I have no 4 sided pyramid as it is folded flat. Yes, I can open it and try
> to form a square. Is that
> what I should do? The pyramid as I have it would form an octagon if opened
> and view from the
> top of the model.
>
> Or did I do the double sink in correctly?
>

It sounds like you did it correctly. Or, at least, as correctly as I did. I
never actually got mine to lay flat after the sink.

What I did next was to try to find that triangle that the instructions talk
about. It turns out that you have to consider three sides of your octagonal
pyramid (two long petal sides and the in-between short petal side) as the single
bottom side of the triangle.Then you take a similar set of three sides of your
pyramid and pinch them together at the top to make a single point at the top.
This leaves a single short-petal-side of the pyramid on either side to be the
other two sides of the triangle.

Then, you've just got to figure out how to lock the "hood". I did it by totally
flattening the two long petals at the top and sliding one inside the other.

I'm still not sure that I've got mine "correct" according to the illustration in
the diagram, but it looks really cool, and so, I decree that it's correct!

I also found that looking at pictures of actual Orchids gave me a feel for where
I wanted to go with the model.

Peace,

Tom Hill
tomh@groupworks.com





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:13:23 -0500
From: Jeff Kerwood <jkerwood@USAOR.NET>
Subject: Business Card Letter Fold
Comments: To: Origami Friends <origami@MIT.EDU>

I want to present a business card along with an informational note. My
thought, use a letter fold for the informational note. The letter fold
would included some corner pockets on it's outside face to hold / display
the business card. I've never seen such a thing, have any of you (if so
where would I find diagrams)? Or, for those with a creative bent this
sounds like an easy challenge.

What this is really about, someone has asked me to make them 12 dragons
which they will give as gifts. I have a business card with my name etc on
it. With this business card I want to give them a sentence or paragraph or
two about the history or myths or an interesting tid-bit about dragons. If
any of you have some little dragon factoid(s) floating about your gray
matter I'd appreciate you passing them my way.

Thanks,
Jeff Kerwood
jkerwood@usaor.net





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:44:31 -1000
From: Paul & Jan Fodor <origami@ALOHA.NET>
Subject: Re: origami and family traditions

As I mentioned before, my grandmother taught me how to do the crane when
I was about 7 years old.  However, there were origami boats, hats which
we called "captain hats" because there was a brim, samurai hats, a
brimless cap, a chinese junk and of course the balloon.  As I recall, we
kids just passed them on amongst us, we lived in a japanese "camp" in
Hawaii and there were adults who interacted with us so they may at some
point gotten us started but I don't remember who.  The usual thing was
we'd see some kid wearing or using an origami and the rest of us would
run home for newspaper and we'd all have a folding party.  Aloha, Jan





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:59:51 +0000
From: Jane Rosemarin <jfrmpls@SPACESTAR.NET>
Subject: Re: Business Card Letter Fold

Jeff,

You could valley fold the left edge of the paper, creasing about an inch
from the edge. Then fold the bottom edge up the same width. Rabbit ear
the corner, squash the rabbit ear and you will have a preliminary base to
make something with. The card could be tucked into the overlapping hems.

I have two books, Folding Lettermarks I and II by Mark Overmars that have
many corner folds that could be adapted (or used as is) to hold business
cards. In particular, there is a simple sailboat by Rie Aberkrom using
the preliminary base idea I described above.

Jane

excerpt from Jeff's message:
>I want to present a business card along with an informational note. My
>thought, use a letter fold for the informational note. The letter fold
>would included some corner pockets on it's outside face to hold / display
>the business card.





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 09:05:51 +0000
From: Jane Rosemarin <jfrmpls@SPACESTAR.NET>
Subject: St. David's Day

Hi!

Does anyone know the story of St. David's Day?

There is a nifty Leek by Tony O'Hare in the February British Origami. At
the end of the instructions it says, "Don't forget to wear on St. David's
Day - March 1st!"

My family has been amusing ourselves speculating what St. David may have
done to be represented by the lowly leek. Did he bring the first onion to
the British Isles?

Thanks for any information.

Jane





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 09:05:54 +0500
From: "K.A. Lundberg" <klundber@MNSINC.COM>
Subject: Re: Orchid

Sheldon Ackerman writes:
   >I have no 4 sided pyramid as it is folded flat. Yes, I can open it
   >and try to form a square. Is that
   >what I should do? The pyramid as I have it would form an octagon if
   >opened and view from the
   >top of the model.

_________
If I understand you correctly...I believe you folded 8 sides into a double
sink when only 4 sides are folded into this sink.

At step 28, if you open the flower by putting your finger into the center
the flower will open into a 4 sided pyramid...this is the square that needs
to be in the sink.  Two of the opposing sides will have the single layer of
paper needed to create one of the small bicolor petals. And the other two
opposing sides will each contain the paper needed to create two of the long
petals and one small bicolor petal, these two sides should be turned into
the sink as one piece maintaining the square shape.  The highest crease
after folding the sink will be the crease that runs through the center of
the "X" created in step 24 as viewed from the top of the flower.  The model
should be 3-D.

The diagram in step 29 shows that once the sink is completed the two single
bicolor petals will be pointing upward and the other two sides (with two
long petals and one short each) will be pointing outwards.  You should see
the 4 sided ridge of the sink running along the inside edge of the petals.

Hope this helps.

Kalei -- klundber@mnsinc.com





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 09:35:39 +0800
From: Soh Kam Yung <firstspeaker@GEOCITIES.COM>
Subject: Re: origami and family traditions

As far as I can remember, Origami folding started with me and my brothers
(I don't remember my parents ever folding any paper models).

It was an interesting experience in 'collaborative folding'.  Whenever I
get stuck with a model, my brothers would take over and figure it out, and
vice versa.

I can still remember the thrill I felt when we finally figured out how to
re-fold the Jackstone (in Robert Harbin's book, "Origami 2") after the
initial pre-creasing.
--
Soh Kam Yung <firstspeaker@geocities.com>
homepage: <http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Lair/2785/>
  "Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent."
  -- Mayor Salvor Hardin, "Foundation", by Isaac Asimov





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 09:40:27 -0600
From: Carol Martinson <carolm@LIBRARY.STPAUL.LIB.MN.US>
Subject: Re: St. David's Day

Jane,

        This is from _The Folklore of World Holidays_, p. 153.

        "St. David, patron saint of Wales, was born in the 5th century at
Henfynyw, Cardigan.  He founded a spartan order of monks at Mynyw.  St.
David is credited with winning a victory over the Saxons by telling the
Welsh soldiers to wear leaks in their helmets so they could recognize each
other on the battlefield.  Leeks are worn on his day by the Welsh.  New
Welsh recruits must eat ritual leeks on this day."

        _Holidays, Festivals, and Celebrations of the World Dictionary, p.
287, adds the information that in the United States the daffodil has
replaced the leek.

        There is a lot more information in the British _Book of Days_
including a poem, and I didn't even look through anything about saints,
Welsh, etc.

        Carol





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:11:07 -0500
From: Jeff Kerwood <jkerwood@USAOR.NET>
Subject: Archive Search Enhancement
Comments: To: Origami Friends <origami@MIT.EDU>

Joseph, I use your archive search a lot, very nice, but I do have one
suggestion for an enhancement that would make it much easier for me (and I
presume others) to use. I like very much that you have a "table of
contents" (the Subject line from the email) at the top of the returned
items. But after I click on the subject and get to the correct email I have
no easy way to get back to the "table of contents" and when I do scroll
back up it is hard for me to find the place to start looking again. What
I'm really saying is I would like to be able to click on a subject line in
the "table of contents" and pop to the email (which it already does nicely)
then be able to pop back up to the same (or next?) subject line in the
"table of contents" (which is what it doesn't do). Or maybe as an easy
quick fix - highlight the "table of contents" subject line when it's
clicked on so that when I scroll back to the top I can find my place again.

I never said thanks to you (Joseph) for all your help during the "crisis" -
Thanks.

Jeff Kerwood
jkerwood@usaor.net





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:19:31 -0500
From: Susan Dugan <florafauna@EMAIL.MSN.COM>
Subject: Re: (NO) Message timing

Joseph,
I receved your first message about the timing with the date

Subject: Re: (NO) Message timing

then the oranageal message-

From: Troy Tate <troy.tate@JUNO.COM>
Date: Wednesday, February 25, 1998 7:48 PM
Subject: (NO) Message timing

I was going to post a note two days ago when  The messages started geting
out of order.
I sent a Saturday, February 21, 1998 11:55 PM reply to author,
got a reply back Saturday, February 21, 1998 11:55 PM
THEN saw my message posted to the list a day or so later there were a lot of
"ooups I did not meen to send that last message to the list" so i asumed
that I was not the only one this hapened to.
no big deal I am just happy the list is running
dont have my proofer with me hope you can muddel throw this note - this is
not one of my better spelling days!!
Susan (hoppit)





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:32:30 -0500
From: Daddy-o D'gou <dwp+@TRANSARC.COM>
Subject: Re: Business Card Letter Fold

On Thu, 26 Feb 1998, Jeff Kerwood indited:

+What this is really about, someone has asked me to make them 12 dragons
+which they will give as gifts. I have a business card with my name etc
on
+it. With this business card I want to give them a sentence or paragraph
or
+two about the history or myths or an interesting tid-bit about dragons.
If
+any of you have some little dragon factoid(s) floating about your gray
+matter I'd appreciate you passing them my way.

I think you should include the name of the creator of the models,
If your name and contact info (presumably from your business card)
were not included I would be inclined to suggest that you also list a
reference for the diagrams, just in case someone is interested. ;-)
Doesn't have to be in big type, or prominently located, but crediting
the creator is the right thing to do.  Aside from that, I suppose any
other info would depend on what kind of gift these are going to be...

-D'gou





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:08:16 -0500 (EST)
From: Kenny1414@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Business Card Letter Fold

Aloha Jeff Kerwood,

In a message dated 98-02-26 08:20:31 EST, you write:

> I want to present a business card along with an informational note. My
>  thought, use a letter fold for the informational note. The letter fold
>  would included some corner pockets on it's outside face to hold / display
>  the business card. I've never seen such a thing, have any of you (if so
>  where would I find diagrams)? Or, for those with a creative bent this
>  sounds like an easy challenge.

Could be engineered. Lots of possibilities.
A few design questions:

    General:
How soon did you need it?
Do you have a mailing address (snail mail)
for those of us without scanners or drawing software?

Do you want the combination to stand up?
Fold flat? Fit into an envelope?
What size would you prefer the finished package?

Umm ... why note + business card, instead of note
on letterhead?

    Paper:
What size/shape is the note? Assuming 8-1/2"x11".
How much of the 8-1/2"x11" did you want to be visible?
Can you print on both sides? Upside down, too?
Does it matter if the printed note is centered?
Visible? Behind a fold?

Do you want the raw edges of the paper folded away
to prevent paper cuts and strengthen the piece?
Or are you planning on using fancy-edged paper,
and want the edge to show?

    Business Card:
What size is the business card?
And what is the shape of the information on the card?

Does the business card have anything on it's back?
(I've seen business cards with English on the front
and Japanese on the back, for instance.)

What is the width of the border of the business card?
Or how large a triangular corner of the business card
can be covered, without covering information?
I.e. does it have to be held in place by pockets
at the corners, or can it be held by a slot along
an edge?

How secure does the business card have to be?
E.g. four corner pockets, two opposite corners,
one upper corner and let friction hold it in place,
one bottom corner and let friction and gravity
hold it, one corner pocket and bend the card
to lock it in place?

Does it matter whether the card sticks out?

Come to think of it, do you want the business
card to be removable?

Do the pieces have to be the same?

There are a number of picture frame folds that could
be adapted to suit. The ones I'm thinking of form four
little triangular pockets, then bring them together
to hold the picture.

There's also Nick Robinson's Wallet from an
8-1/2"x11" sheet.

If you fold Robert Neale's Dragon's neck and head,
there's enough paper left over to form a small tray,
about large enough to hold a business card.
I added an extra first joint to the neck, for better
attitude. If you fiddle with the angle of the tray edge,
the cobination will stand up by itself.

Just thinking out loud.

Thank you for this interesting puzzle.

Aloha,
Kenneth M. Kawmura    ( kenny1414@aol.com )
328 N. Fairview
Lansing, MI 48912-3110





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:19:27 -0500 (EST)
From: Kenny1414@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Business Card Letter Fold

In a message dated 98-02-26 08:20:31 EST, Jeff Kerwood writes:

> I want to present a business card along with an informational note.

Second thought:

Or, maybe, just snug the business card up to a corner,
fold a small rabbit-ear, thru both the card and the paper,
squash both layers of the stubby ear, and tuck it into the pocket,
to attach the card by one corner?

Aloha,
Kenneth M. Kawamura ( kenny1414@aol.com )





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:29:40 -0800
From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Subject: Re: (NO): Links from Joseph Wu's Web page

First of all, what with all of the noise before about not wanting to have
any sort of associations between me, or the company I work for, and the
list, I find it amusing that questions about my website are coming to the
list instead of to me directly. The website is called "Joseph Wu's Origami
Page" after all. Does this mean that I can change the name of this list to
"Joseph Wu's Origami List"?

>I hadn't checked out Joseph Wu's web page in over a month,
>due to multiple projects, work and a bunch of work related
>computer matters. Well, I discovered first hand what some
>members of the origami-L were talking about when they said
>they couldn't open any of the links from Joseph's pages.

When I first heard about the problem, I asked people to check to make sure
that it wasn't just a transient problem (since it was first reported when
there was that DNS glitch in Western North America) and to report back to
me if it was still a problem. No one reported back, so I assumed that it
was transient and did nothing.

>Using AmericaOnLine version 3.5 for Win3.x, with its old
>"native" well behaved built in browser, I visited Joseph's site.
>
>After opening the top page, I jumped to the USA links list
>to see what was new, and tried a couple of links, including
>the ones to my own pages.
>
>Each generated an error message that the link could not be
>opened, "possibly due to network traffic".

I am using a very simple redirection script so that I can get an idea of
who's going where from my site. The script does nothing fancy. It just
gives a new "Location:" for the browser to go to (which is standard as of
HTTP 1.0). This is the first I've heard of a problem with this response
header.

>So I switched to Compuserve with Microsoft Internet Explorer
>v. 3.01 for Win3.x. I transferred to the South American link
>list OK, but attempts to open individual links produced a more
>informative error message: "Your software does not have the
>necessary protocol to process cgi script such-and-such" (the
>cgi script that handles the link.)

Again, this is the script. I'll check the programming (although I'm pretty
sure it's not wrong), and I'll consider getting rid of it.

>Then my attempt to switch to the USA link page resulted in a
>crash of Explorer, followed by a crash of Win3.11 Program manager,
>followed by a cold boot.

I suspect that this is a memory problem. The USA link page is rather large,
and is known to cause problems with some browsers running on machines with
low memory. If this is not the problem in your case, then I have no idea
why it might be doing that. I have other very long pages that cause some
problems: try checking out
<http://www.origami.vancouver.bc.ca/Usage/domain.html>.

>Granted, the AOL browser is a little antiquated, but it can handle
>the kind of secure transaction server than Amazon.com used, and
>it doesn't take up my entire hard drive, keeps all its stuff in
>its own directories, and doesn't try to take control of my life
>like some software does.
>
>Similarly, Explorer 3.01 (Compuserve version) works quite nicely
>99% of the time, and I refuse to upgrade either one of these
>installations to MSIExplorer4 because every installation I've
>done of that (and I'm my company's computer person) has resulted
>in a collossal mess and waste of time, and Navigator is only
>slightly better.
>
>I know from email and conversations that I'm not the only one of
>AOL's 10 million members, or of Compuserves 2 million, who is
>not using the latest and greatest whiz bang operating system
>and browser for similar reasons or because their hardware won't
>support them.
>
>How about a nice alternate plain old standard HTML page with
>ordinary vanilla links for "the rest of us" so we can get
>"where we want to go today", Joseph?

I have consistently tried to keep a balance between old technology and new
technology on my website so that appearance/functionality is not improved
to the exclusion of people with older browsers. However, remember that I
maintain this page mainly for me, when I have the time to deal with it. All
of my expenses are strictly out of pocket, and my time is limited (now more
so with my mailing list responsibilities and having to fend off web
thieves). I do the best I can, but I cannot keep up with the capabilities
(or incapabilities) of every browser in existence. So, while I thank you
for your detailed comments (because otherwise I wouldn't know), I cannot
promise that I can fix everything anytime soon.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t:604.730.0306 x 105     f: 604.732.7331     e: josephwu@ultranet.ca





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:32:04 -0800
From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Subject: Re: (NO): Links from Joseph Wu's Web page

>Hear! Hear!  When I try to open the main page in Netscape 3.0,
>the dragon comes up as a jigsaw puzzle.  Then the browser
>crashes.  I really don't want to upgrade to IE 4.0 just
>to view one page.  Bring back the HTML!

This one I'll change right now. As for "bringing back the HTML", what do you
think I'm using to write this stuff? Granted, I use Javascript, but my code
is written so that browsers that can't handle it should be able to just
ignore it.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t:604.730.0306 x 105     f: 604.732.7331     e: josephwu@ultranet.ca





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:39:10 -0500 (EST)
From: Kenny1414@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Business Card Letter Fold

In a message dated 98-02-26 08:20:31 EST, you, Jeff Kerwood, write:

> I want to present a business card along with an informational note. My
>  thought, use a letter fold for the informational note.

Third thought:

That was fun. I just tried to fold half of Robert Neale's Dragon
as a letterfold, in the upper right corner. The dragon cooperated
by stretching out flat, lengthwise. Not as graceful, but easier to fold.

Makes a nice border for the note.

I think, if I stuck a business card inside  the back of the
preliminary base,  before sinking the back, that the card
would end up being held there.

Aloha,
Kenneth M. Kawamura    ( kenny1414@aol.com )





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:39:43 -0500
From: Valerie Vann <valerie_vann@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Subject: St. David's Day

I don't know the story, but I'm Scots, not Welsh, :-)

However, I'm busy trying to finish a group of Red Dragons
(like the Welsh Coat of Arms) for a friend who is doing
the flowers/table decorations for the local Welsh Society'e
St. David Day's dinner Sat.

I'm using Perry Bailey's wonderful flapping wing Firelizard
design for the dragons. (Diagrams on a link from my
web pages and in the origami-L archive.)

The traditional flowers, by the way are yellow daffodils
(Dafyd-Down-Dillies)...

--valerie
Valerie Vann
valerie_vann@compuserve.com
 Mostly Modular/Geometric Origami Web Pages:
   http://people.delphi.com/vvann/index.html
   http://members.aol.com/valerivann/index.html
  Magic Rose Cube (photos, no diagrams yet)
   http://people.delphi.com/vvann/magicros.html





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:43:11 -0500
From: Sheldon Ackerman <ackerman@DORSAI.ORG>
Subject: Re: Orchid

>
> Sheldon Ackerman writes:
>    >I have no 4 sided pyramid as it is folded flat. Yes, I can open it
>    >and try to form a square. Is that
>    >what I should do? The pyramid as I have it would form an octagon if
>    >opened and view from the
>    >top of the model.
>
> _________
> If I understand you correctly...I believe you folded 8 sides into a double
> sink when only 4 sides are folded into this sink.
>
> At step 28, if you open the flower by putting your finger into the center
> the flower will open into a 4 sided pyramid...this is the square that needs
> to be in the sink.

Gotcha! Yep. You are correct. I did do a double sink on ALL the sides.
Back to the drawing board I will unsink the sink and see whether I can still
manage with the model that I have. It is has creases galore at this point.

Thanks for taking the time to post your explanation, Kalei

---
Sheldon Ackerman.......http://www.dorsai.org/~ackerman/
ackerman@dorsai.org
sheldon_ackerman@fc1.nycenet.edu





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:46:13 -0500
From: Sheldon Ackerman <ackerman@DORSAI.ORG>
Subject: Re: Orchid

>
> It sounds like you did it correctly. Or, at least, as correctly as I did. I
> never actually got mine to lay flat after the sink.

Thanks :-)
See KAL's post regarding the double sink the way I did and the way you
probably did it.

>
> I'm still not sure that I've got mine "correct" according to the illustration
 in
> the diagram, but it looks really cool, and so, I decree that it's correct!
>
> I also found that looking at pictures of actual Orchids gave me a feel for
 where
> I wanted to go with the model.
>
> Peace,
>
> Tom Hill
> tomh@groupworks.com
>
Yep...I have to make a trip to the florist! I know what a rose and lily look
like. Have to hunt me up an orchid :-)

--
---
Sheldon Ackerman.......http://www.dorsai.org/~ackerman/
ackerman@dorsai.org
sheldon_ackerman@fc1.nycenet.edu





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 12:06:22 -0800
From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Subject: Re: Archive Search Enhancement

>Joseph, I use your archive search a lot, very nice, but I do have one
>suggestion for an enhancement that would make it much easier for me (and I
>presume others) to use. I like very much that you have a "table of
>contents" (the Subject line from the email) at the top of the returned
>items. But after I click on the subject and get to the correct email I have
>no easy way to get back to the "table of contents" and when I do scroll
>back up it is hard for me to find the place to start looking again. What
>I'm really saying is I would like to be able to click on a subject line in
>the "table of contents" and pop to the email (which it already does nicely)
>then be able to pop back up to the same (or next?) subject line in the
>"table of contents" (which is what it doesn't do). Or maybe as an easy
>quick fix - highlight the "table of contents" subject line when it's
>clicked on so that when I scroll back to the top I can find my place again.

The highlighting thing should work already. Once you've clicked on the
link, it should change colour since it is now a "visited link". As for
popping back to the same subject line, I guess that's possible, but it
would just slow down the loading of the page even more (another set of
links to include in the page). I'll put it on my "to do" list.

BTW, Valerie, do you have any problems with searches that return long
messages? I'd like to confirm if your Compuserve browser crashes because of
that.

Also, Bernie, looking at the timestamps on the messages in the archives, it
looks like the NSTN list software converted the message dates to Atlantic
Time.

>I never said thanks to you (Joseph) for all your help during the "crisis" -
>Thanks.

Crisis? If you mean the list move, you're most welcome.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t:604.730.0306 x 105     f: 604.732.7331     e: josephwu@ultranet.ca





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 12:31:02 -0800
From: Eric Eros <eros@MOHAWK.ENGR.SGI.COM>
Subject: Re: (NO): Links from Joseph Wu's Web page

My experience with the dragon jigsaw puzzle is that if I resize the Netscape
window to be somewhat wider, the dragon displays correctly, albeit it always
displays as a jigsaw puzzle the first time, at my window's normal width.

I have no problems with links that don't work from the page.

My experience with crashes is that I don't dare hit Netscape's 'Back' button
from any of Mr. Wu's pages, or pages I've gone to via pointers from his pages.
If I navigate from them without using this button, I don't crash.

I'm using Netscape Navigator 3.04 on IRIX 6.2

--
Eric Eros





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 13:48:04 -0800 (PST)
From: Wayne Fluharty <wflu@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: (NO): Links from Joseph Wu's Web page

I also haven't had any problems with Josephs's pages. I am runnin'
Netscape Communicator 4.02 in a Win 3.11 environment at work and a Win95
environment at home though a local ISP with no problems.

I would also like to thank Joseph for the time and effort that he must
spend on his page. Every new origimi-ist I run across is provided with
his web page as one of the first sources of information. Thanks again,
Joseph!

Wayne "Flu" Fluharty
wflu@hotmail.com

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 13:57:09 -0800
From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Subject: Fwd: Southeastern Origami Festival Information
Comments: To: origami@MIT.EDU

I'm forwarding this for Norm while I figure out why he can't post to the list.

>DORIGAMI and other interested folders,
>
>The Southeastern Origami Festival will be September 22-27, 1998.  Postcards
>have recently been sent with our first announcement to everyone on our
>mailing list.  (My copy was postmarked on 2/22, and I received it
>yesterday, 2/25.)  If you would like to add your name to our list, please
>send me (privately) your name, addresses (snail and e-mail), phone, fax,
>etc.  To quote from the postcard:
>
>SOUTHEASTERN ORIGAMI FESTIVAL
>September 22-27, 1998
>
>A World-Class Event Featuring:  Regional-National Artists
>Celebrating the paper folding arts
>
>Lectures-Demonstrations-Supplies-Master Classes-Competitions-Multilevel
>Workshops-Sightseeing-Souvenirs-Entertainment
>
>
>
>
>-------------------------------------------------------------
>Norman Budnitz         919-684-3592 (day)
>nbudnitz@duke.edu              919-383-0553 (eve)
>
>Dept of Zoology, Duke Univ, Box 90325, Durham NC 27708 (work)
>4115 Garrett Drive, Durham NC 27705 (home)
>
>PROGRESS: the victory of laughter over dogma.
>(Tom Robbins, Half Asleep in Frog Pajamas)
>

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t:604.730.0306 x 105     f: 604.732.7331     e: josephwu@ultranet.ca





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 14:16:25 -0700
From: Nigel Pottle <fowlerj1@CADVISION.COM>
Subject: Re: origami enthusiast survey

----------
> From: John Sutter <sutterj@EARTHLINK.NET>
> To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject: origami enthusiast survey
> Date: Thursday, February 26, 1998 8:16 AM
>
> Hi Origamians,
>
> My curiosity about origami history and interest in how much the art of
paper
> folding has spread and by whom has led me to pose the following questions
to list members:
>
>      1) Who or What got you interested in learning origami?
The book by Maying Soong - The Art of Chinese Paperfolding. Read at age 10
for the first time.

>      2) Was it a solitary pursuit or a collaaborative effort?
I was the only person I knew who folded when I was growing up.

>      3) Do you do it as a hobby?
It is my fun and relaxation time.

>      4) Did you learn it as a child?
See question 1.

>      5) What models do you remember from childhood and are they commonly
> found basic origami books?
A lot of Maying Soong's designs. Waterbomb, flapping bird, lighthouse
bookmark, pagoda, others I remember but never fold.

>      6) Do you teach it to groups formally or informally?
I have taught groups, just recently at a teachers' convention with four
colleagues. I have also done sessions in a church and as a school club.

>      7) Are you a professional who makes a living from origami books,
> workshops etc.? I recognize some names
> like Joseph Wu in this category and I hope they will respond.
I'm a professional teacher and librarian, but not a professional origamist.

>      8) Have you done family oriented workshops? No.

>      9) Do you think origami could become as popular in America as it has
> become in Japan or do you think most Americans are too impatient?  ( I
find many kids and adults don't have long enough attention spans to
> go beyond basic origami).
I don't think it has anything to do with impatience. Origami is a cultural
institution in Japan. The US and Canada have a different cultural milieu.
As well, North America is very culturally diverse. A better question might
be, have Japanese-Americans or Japanese-Canadians continued the cultural
tradition of origami in North America?

>     10) I think it could be a good family activity if young parents could
be
> turned on to the fun, educational and cultural benefits-What do you
think?

I am sure that the family that folded together might stay together.
>
> My original interest was to find out whether members might have learned
> origami from parents or other family
> members, as it has been done in Japan and other Asian countries.  I
expected
> most responses from Asian Americans, Latin Americans, Anglicans,and
people of Arab ancestry to respond
> because of what I've read on the history of origami.  I expect that
computers and the information age
> will change the history of paper folding and speed its popularity across
the world.

Anglicans? In Canada those are members of the Anglican Church of Canada. I
am just a poor boy from a mining town in the middle of Newfoundland, now
living and working as a teacher librarian in a city in the foothills of the
Rocky Mountains of Canada.
>
> Thanks in advance to anybody who takes the time to respond,
Good luck.
> Ria Sutter





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 15:40:17 -0800
From: Joseph Wu <josephwu@ULTRANET.CA>
Subject: Re: origami enthusiast survey

>My curiosity about origami history and interest in how much the art of paper
>folding has spread and by
>whom has led me to pose the following questions to list members:

Ria, check out the archives for introductions from various people. It used
to be a custom for new members to this list to introduce themselves and
tell about how they got into origami. You will also find some of these
topics discussed in more detail.

>     1) Who or What got you interested in learning origami?

My father bought me a book (coincidentally by Yoshizawa) when I was three
years old (living in Hong Kong).

>     2) Was it a solitary pursuit or a collaaborative effort?

It was a solitary pursuit.

>     3) Do you do it as a hobby?

Mainly, although I manage to earn a little bit of money off of it.

>     4) Did you learn it as a child?

Yes.

>     5) What models do you remember from childhood and are they commonly
>found basic origami books?

My early knowledge is from Yoshizawa's book, "Origami". In fact, I later
learned some of the traditional models (e.g. crane, frog, etc.) and I
thought that they were "wrong" because they were different from the
versions that Yoshizawa included in that book. I did learn some other
models that appear to be part of a more "Chinese" tradition, but some
people get upset when I talk about that. 8)

>     6) Do you teach it to groups formally or informally?

I do both.

>     7) Are you a professional who makes a living from origami books,
>workshops etc.? I recognize some names
>like Joseph Wu in this category and I hope they will respond.

Well, this is amusing since I don't make a living from origami books.
Indeed, I have never written a book, nor have I ever charged for a
workshop...oh, wait. There was one. I do make a bit of money doing origami
for advertising, but not much. The money is good, but the jobs are few and
far between.

>     8) Have you done family oriented workshops?

Yes.

>     9) Do you think origami could become as popular in America as it has
>become in Japan or do you think
>most Americans are too impatient?  ( I find many kids and adults don't have
>long enough attention spans to
>go beyond basic origami)

I've written at greater length about this topic, but I would say that this
is a mistaken notion of people who do not live in Japan. When I was there,
I most of the people I met remembered doing it in school, but had
completely forgotten about it since then. Indeed, they had no idea that
origami could be so complex or artistic. The origami people there are like
the origami people anywhere: talented and devoted, but considered a little
bit weird by the masses.

>    10) I think it could be a good family activity if young parents could be
>turned on to the fun, educational
>and cultural benefits-What do you think?

Of course! But that is true of many things besides origami. Naturally, we
are biased toward origami...

>My original interest was to find out whether members might have learned
>origami from parents or other family
>members, as it has been done in Japan and other Asian countries.  I expected
>most responses from Asian
>Americans, Latin Americans, Anglicans,and people of Arab ancestry to respond
>because of what I've read on
>the history of origami.  I expect that computers and the information age
>will change the history of paper
>folding and speed its popularity across the world.

For reference, I'm a Canadian of Chinese descent who was born in Hong Kong.
You'll find that the demographics of origami are much wider than what you
presume. The membership of this mailing list is a good testament to that
fact.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Joseph Wu, Origami Artist and Multimedia Producer
t:604.730.0306 x 105     f: 604.732.7331     e: josephwu@ultranet.ca





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 16:07:33 -0500
From: Kenneth Lehner <klehner@LUCENT.COM>
Subject: Re: (NO): Links from Joseph Wu's Web page

Joseph,

I just wanted to let you know that I appreciate exactly what you've
done with your Web site and the mailing list.  That would apply if you'd
done less and if you do more.

Best of luck with those wascally Web rustlers!

Ken Lehner





Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 16:21:59 -0500
From: Jeff Kerwood <jkerwood@USAOR.NET>
Subject: Re: origami enthusiast survey

----------
> From: John Sutter <sutterj@EARTHLINK.NET>
> To: ORIGAMI@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject: origami enthusiast survey
> Date: Thursday, February 26, 1998 10:16 AM
>
> Hi Origamians,
>
> My curiosity about origami history and interest in how much the art of
paper
> folding has spread and by
> whom has led me to pose the following questions to list members:
>
>      1) Who or What got you interested in learning origami?
Just picked up a book at a book store

>      2) Was it a solitary pursuit or a collaaborative effort?
collaborative (with wife)

>      3) Do you do it as a hobby?
yes

>      4) Did you learn it as a child?
no

>      5) What models do you remember from childhood and are they commonly
> found basic origami books?
none

>      6) Do you teach it to groups formally or informally?
no

>      7) Are you a professional who makes a living from origami books,
> workshops etc.? I recognize some names
> like Joseph Wu in this category and I hope they will respond.
no

>      8) Have you done family oriented workshops?
no

>      9) Do you think origami could become as popular in America as it has
> become in Japan or do you think
> most Americans are too impatient?  ( I find many kids and adults don't
have
> long enough attention spans to
> go beyond basic origami)
?

>     10) I think it could be a good family activity if young parents could
be
> turned on to the fun, educational
> and cultural benefits-What do you think?
sure

> My original interest was to find out whether members might have learned
> origami from parents or other family
> members, as it has been done in Japan and other Asian countries.  I
expected
> most responses from Asian
> Americans, Latin Americans, Anglicans,and people of Arab ancestry to
respond
> because of what I've read on
> the history of origami.  I expect that computers and the information age
> will change the history of paper
> folding and speed its popularity across the world.
>
> Thanks in advance to anybody who takes the time to respond,
> Ria Sutter
