




Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 23:41:10 -0300
From: Jae Hyuk Lee <jaelee@WPI.EDU>
Subject: Changing the subject: line

>>some internet users (e.g. Delphi) *cannot* change the subject...

> Well I suppose the answer to THAT is, if you're pretty well off the subject,
> don't just REPLY, mail a NEW message with a new more appropriate subject
> to the list...    [......]

That's what I wanted to suggest to that particular mailing list, but....
by that point, the thread had degenerated into a flame war where one faction
basically said, "If you don't like reading posts that do not exactly meet
your specs/prefs, unsubscribe!!!  Get a life!!!"

My last post on an off topic subject...  Back to origami.  I hope the BARF
person gets back soon, so I can order the back issue with the Enterprise
model in it.  :)

--
   |\_                                                  ___.-.___  ________
   | =\_.     o            jaelee@wpi.edu     M  _  o   \_______/ (|______/
  /______)   <M\     \o      Jae H. Lee       a (_|_/}     `-'_\\___||_  BDFT
 //O"O"O"O   / > o _^/>  Worcester Polytech.  c ]"[ <T       )[______.-'  #42





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 23:45:02 -0300
From: Marc Kirschenbaum <marckrsh@pipeline.com>
Subject: Ligia Montoya

On Mon, 24 Jul 1995 "Lisa, Hodsdon" <LISAHAB@vax3.hmco.com> said:

>Jay Ansill talks about Ligia Montoya and her original form of origami in
>_Lifestyle Origami_ . I haven't heard anything about her anywhere else.
Can
>anyone tell me more information about her and/or her work?
>
There was an article on her in _The Origamian_; I will see if I can dig it
up. From what I remember, she had a style that was based on her mentor's (I
forgot his name). Her mentor shunned her, so to speak (I think that he
accused her of stealing his creations), and she was afraid to show her work
again.
A simmilar thing happened with Patricia Crawford. In her case, her husband
has prevented her from participating in origami. I guess that we had to
loose two great creators as a result of them being pushed around.

Marc





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 23:52:05 -0300
From: Jae Hyuk Lee <jaelee@WPI.EDU>
Subject: Paper size for Enterprise model

Regarding the Enterprise model, Vern wrote:

> I made one that when finished was about a foot long. It was.. [.....]

I know it'll be a while before I can request the BARF back issue, but
could you tell us what size/shape paper you used to get a foot-long model?

--
   |\_                                                  ___.-.___  ________
   | =\_.     o            jaelee@wpi.edu     M  _  o   \_______/ (|______/
  /______)   <M\     \o      Jae H. Lee       a (_|_/}     `-'_\\___||_  BDFT
 //O"O"O"O   / > o _^/>  Worcester Polytech.  c ]"[ <T       )[______.-'  #42





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 00:05:28 -0300
From: Marc Kirschenbaum <marckrsh@pipeline.com>
Subject: Recommendations for 10" paper?

On Mon, 24 Jul 1995 "Sue Sierra" <ssierra@math.lsa.umich.edu> said:

>Does anyone have a recommendation for origami paper, approx. 10" on a
side,
>that I can trust to be square?  I want what I think is called kami weight,
the
>kind that is colored on one side and white on the other.

After going through different vendors, the supplies center for Origami USA,
The Origami Source, has found a vendor with an accurate cutting machine.
Their info is in the FAQ.

Marc





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 00:21:29 -0300
From: Valerie Vann <75070.304@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Paper for the cuckoo clock &  school supplies

Besides the really big bulletin board paper Lillian mentions, some
school supply stores carry a type of paper called "FadeLess"tm.
It comes in about 16-20 colors 1 side 12x18 in and also recently
I saw bigger & I think rolls and DUO (2 different colors!) in a
mail order school catalog. I haven't checked out this new stuff yet,
but the 12x18 has been around for years.

It REALLY IS FADELESS! Nearly 20 years ago I made a modular poly of
some and it hung in my office for most of that in florescent light and
sunlight, both of which usually get paper colors to fade in a very short
time, especially blues. but this stuff stayed bright for about 15 years,
and after 20 only the blues and purples were noticeably going. I finally
took it home (no florescents) and its settled into a pastel sort of range.

"Fadesless" is about twice the weight of kami I'd guess and folds well, tho
too thick for itty bitty details. Good for modulars.

--valerie
Compuserve: Valerie Vann 75070,304
Internet: 75070.304@compuserve.com
Internet: valerivann@aol.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 00:21:44 -0300
From: Valerie Vann <75070.304@compuserve.com>
Subject: RE: Kawasaki Rose Query

Grace Chiu writes: <<And this mangled tesselation still sits here on my
     desk...<<

When I read this message I didn't know whether to chuckle or cry! Sounds like
     Grace has
folded herself into the origamist's worst nightmare, and I'm the cause of it.

After you make the sinks they should be twisted in opposite directions in
pairs. That is, each sink has 4 arms radiating out from it, and each arm
links to a neighbor's arm that radiates in the opposite direction.

(The 12 and 8 initial creases result in extra creases, but it seemed
easier to me); make the sinks using only the ones shown on the diagram. In
fact, copy the fold map and fold it up!)

The top after making the sinks should look like wide ribbons woven
over and under each other. Next stand the edges of the ribbons up in parallel
pairs (at the edges marked "pinch" on the diagram). The centers of the sinks
will open up where the "ribbons" cross over each other. The ribbons will fold in
the middle along the valley folds and turn into vertical "walls". These
walls end up sort of U shaped, curving around on each end into the center of the
roses (the sinks)

    _______           __________________            ______
       __  \   | |   /   ___      ___   \   |  |   / __
      /     \  | |  /       \    /       \  |  |  /     \
    /  /       | |       \   \  /    /      |  |      \  \
   /  |   S    | |    S   |  |  |   |   S   |  |   S   |  |
   |  |     _ /   \ __    |  |  |   |   ___/    \___   |  |
   |   \_________________/   |  |    \________________/   |
   |     ________________    |  |     ________________    |
   |    /  __       _ _  \   |  |    / __        __   \   |
   |   |      \    /      \  |  |   /    \      /      \  |
   |   |   S   |  |   S   |  |  |  |   S  \    /  S    |  |
    \   \      |  |       /  /  \  \       |  |       /  /
     \__    /  |  |  \   ___/    \___   /  |  |  \    __/
  _________/   |  |   \________________/   |  |   \________

The "S"s are the centers of the sinks/roses, with 4 vertical "walls"/petals
twisting into them. This is the Top View. The bottoms of the sinks at "S" are
half as deep as the valley fold/slot in between the "walls" where the walls are
parallel (at the "pinch" places on the diagram.)

The ASCII diagram above shows one half the finished 4x4 array of 16 sinks/roses.

--valerie





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 00:37:44 -0300
From: Valerie Vann <75070.304@compuserve.com>
Subject: Rose Crystal. Query

I got an error message that this didn't go out the first time and it got
mangled, so if it did go, I apologize for the second posting:  :-(

Grace Chiu writes: <<And this mangled tesselation still sits here on my
     desk...<<

When I read this message I didn't know whether to chuckle or cry! Sounds like
     Grace has
folded herself into the origamist's worst nightmare, and I'm the cause of it.

After you make the sinks they should be twisted in opposite directions in
pairs. That is, each sink has 4 arms radiating out from it, and each arm
links to a neighbor's arm that radiates in the opposite direction.

(The 12 and 8 initial creases result in extra creases, but it seemed
easier to me); make the sinks using only the ones shown on the diagram. In
fact, copy the fold map and fold it up!)

The top after making the sinks should look like wide ribbons woven
over and under each other. Next stand the edges of the ribbons up in parallel
pairs (at the edges marked "pinch" on the diagram). The centers of the sinks
will open up where the "ribbons" cross over each other. The ribbons will fold in
the middle along the valley folds and turn into vertical "walls". These
walls end up sort of U shaped, curving around on each end into the center of the
roses (the sinks)

    _______           __________________            ______
       __  \   | |   /   ___      ___   \   |  |   / __
      /     \  | |  /       \    /       \  |  |  /     \
    /  /       | |       \   \  /    /      |  |      \  \
   /  |   S    | |    S   |  |  |   |   S   |  |   S   |  |
   |  |     _ /   \ __    |  |  |   |   ___/    \___   |  |
   |   \_________________/   |  |    \________________/   |
   |     ________________    |  |     ________________    |
   |    /  __       _ _  \   |  |    / __        __   \   |
   |   |      \    /      \  |  |   /    \      /      \  |
   |   |   S   |  |   S   |  |  |  |   S  \    /  S    |  |
    \   \      |  |       /  /  \  \       |  |       /  /
     \__    /  |  |  \   ___/    \___   /  |  |  \    __/
  _________/   |  |   \________________/   |  |   \________

The "S"s are the centers of the sinks/roses, with 4 vertical "walls"/petals
twisting into them. This is the Top View. The bottoms of the sinks at "S" are
half as deep as the valley fold/slot in between the "walls" where the walls are
parallel (at the "pinch" places on the diagram.)

The ASCII diagram above shows one half the finished 4x4 array of 16 sinks/roses.

--valerie





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 01:10:14 -0300
From: "BOB T. LYNCH" <blynch@du.edu>
Subject: ant on the edge

Speaking of the ant following along on something... didn't there used to be
some sort of explanation of SOMETHING that had an ant crawling along on the edge
of a record that was spinning on a turntable (for those of you who don't know
what a record or turntable is, ask your folks...) I'm afraid all I remember
of the explanation is thinking about sick the ant would be once he got off the
record player!

Dee





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 01:39:41 -0300
From: Joseph Wu <jwu@cs.ubc.ca>
Subject: Re: Ligia Montoya

On Mon, 24 Jul 1995, Marc Kirschenbaum wrote:

> There was an article on her in _The Origamian_; I will see if I can dig it
> up. From what I remember, she had a style that was based on her mentor's (I
> forgot his name). Her mentor shunned her, so to speak (I think that he
> accused her of stealing his creations), and she was afraid to show her work
> again.

For those who don't know, Ligia Montoya is no longer with us. I believe
that her mentor was Cerceda, but I'm not certain. Ligia was from South
America (Argentina, I believe), and was one of the finest paperfolders from
the Spanish/Moorish tradition, along with Cerceda and Unamuno (sp?). Her
works can be found in some of Randlett's books, as well as in Ansill's
_Lifestyle_Origami_ (AKA _Practical_Origami_).

> A simmilar thing happened with Patricia Crawford. In her case, her husband
> has prevented her from participating in origami. I guess that we had to
> loose two great creators as a result of them being pushed around.

Pat is still around, and some of her greatest models have been
re-diagrammed and published in Jay Nolan's book, _Creating_Origami_. Older,
and poorer-quality, diagrams can be found in one of Kenneway's books.

Joseph Wu      <jwu@cs.ubc.ca> | Witty quote is now back to the
Master's Student               |   drawing board due to squeamish
University of British Columbia |   readers. Any suggestions?
WWW: http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/jwu/origami.html (Origami Page)





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 02:54:16 -0300
From: VickyAV@aol.com
Subject: Jewelry coating for Washi

I noticed some dialog about jewelry coatings.  I had created origami jewelry
a few years ago, and on a trip to Japan had found this wonderful "glaze" made
especially for washi jewelry projects - although not necessarily for origami,
it worked beautifully to coat and protect the model without giving it that
awful (my opinion) shiny glaze.

The goop was similar in texture and non-toxicity to white glue, and it didn't
have that toxic smell that Joli Glaze does.  I bought it from a chain of
stores called Sakura Horikiri, and I think there is one in the Los Angeles
area.  I'll have to check to see if it is still there.  My folks at Paper
Tree in San Francisco have been trying to import it also.  Will let you know
if they are successful.

Vicky Mihara Avery





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 03:30:42 -0300
From: VickyAV@aol.com
Subject: Professional Origami

This is in response to dialog about origami "for pay" or "for sale".
 Although I cannot claim "ala Michael Shall" to be a full-time professional
paperfolder, I have been fortunate to do quite a few jobs over the past 20
(or so) years.

Recently, with the help of other San Francisco area folders (like Eric Tend,
Chris Palmer & Jeremy Shafer), we just completed a very nice job for a
advertising firm representing Bank of America.  They needed 4,000 airplanes.
 They needed it using one-dollar bills.   They needed this in three
weeks...They need the planes to fly...

 I gave them several options (it took two bills taped together) and they
chose "the practice plane" by Thay Yang from his newly released airplane
collaboration with John Collins & ? (rats, can't find the book or remember
the title at this moment...)

Anyway, the job was done on time (with 12 folders involved) and the client
was very pleased.  I negotiated a "creator's fee" to Thay for the use of the
model and paid each folder $2 per plane.  We got crisp bills to fold with,
straight from the Fed Reserve!

Then right on the heels of that job, I was commisioned to fold a dozen roses
(Kawasaki's of course) with the Wall Street Journal, for the Wall St. Journal
as a gift/gimmick to some exec at Microsoft.

I guess the point I should make now is that I have been able to charge
anywhere from $50 to $200 per hour for my origami skills.   Of course to
offset the paid jobs there has been alot of the "free" sessions to share
origami with libraries, schools and church events so it would be difficult to
do this kind of thing "as a job" like Michael did.  He (and I too) believe
that when you have the chance to work with "professional" companies then
don't sell yourself (or origami) short.  It is a valuable skill/artform and
we need to work together to change the perception that it is merely "child's
play".

Vicky Mihara Avery





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 08:07:05 -0300
From: logician!sophie!pat@uunet.uu.net (Pat Zura)
Subject: Re: Vocation  Compilation

While not strictly an origami topic this thread has been most interesting,
adding another dimension to the origamists on the list.  I suspect
that many lurkers chimed in on this one.

Happy folding,

Pat





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 10:08:31 -0300
From: Jennifer.Campbell@cciw.ca (Jennifer Campbell)
Subject: Re: ant on the edge

>Speaking of the ant following along on something... didn't there used to be
>some sort of explanation of SOMETHING that had an ant crawling along on the
>edge
>of a record that was spinning on a turntable (for those of you who don't know
>what a record or turntable is, ask your folks...) I'm afraid all I remember
>of the explanation is thinking about sick the ant would be once he got off the
>record player!
>
>Dee

Would this have been in a high school physics textbook, in the chapter on
rotational motion? I recall a description of angular momentum using a
record turntable and something "walking" in circles on it in different
places (edge, middle, standing at the centre)...
P.S. the same theory goes for the CD, just the ant would get even sicker!
(and you'd wreck the machine)

       /\_/\       ________
     `(     )' oo /        \
       `==='     | Maguro o |
       /   \     |  kudasai |
      |     |     \________/
      |     |
    ___\___/__jennifer.campbell@cciw.ca





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 10:53:38 -0300
From: mkennon@nando.net
Subject: RE: Recommendations for 10" paper?

I am new to the list so please pardon me, but where can the FAQ be located?

>>Does anyone have a recommendation for origami paper, approx. 10" on a
>side,
>>that I can trust to be square?  I want what I think is called kami weight,
>the
>>kind that is colored on one side and white on the other.
>
>After going through different vendors, the supplies center for Origami USA,
>The Origami Source, has found a vendor with an accurate cutting machine.
>Their info is in the FAQ.

-------------------------------------
Name: Mike Kennon
E-mail: mkennon@nando.net
Date: 07/25/95
Time: 09:51:39





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 11:16:58 -0300
From: Beck Twachtman Hutchinson <HUTCHIB@mail.firn.edu>
Subject: Re: VOCATION

Greetings, One of our memebers from FOLD (Florida Origami Learners and
Devotees) is going to be in Colombia. He isn't able to have access to the
net, yet and he asked me to ask if I could find any origami connections or
contacts for him. Can you help? Many thanks, Beck





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 11:32:10 -0300
From: JRMetzger@aol.com
Subject: Re:  Paper for the cuckoo clock

Marmonk, Dee -

Pearl Art & Supplies carries Fadeless Art Paper in rolls of 4 feet by 12 feet
(colored on one side) for about $5. They also carry rolls of paper by
"Savage" which are 53 inches by 12 yards (colored on both sides) for $20.
They had these in the New Jersey store (I picked up a roll of Fadeless to
make a large bookcase (by Uchiyama, in Harbin's Secrets of Origami), haven't
made the large version yet, small ones come out great, especially when I make
teeny-eeny cranes and frogs to put in them...), I assume they can also be
obtained through their mail order (800-221-6845).
Good luck!

Jacob





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 11:44:09 -0300
From: Richard Kennedy <KENNEDRA@ibm3090.bham.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Patricia Crawford

Joseph Wu mentioned sources for diagrams of Patricia Crawford's creations.
Almost half of Robert Harbin's book "Origami a Step-by-Step Guide" is
given over to her work. The Harbin book is sadly out of print, but I
believe that a version in Dutch is still in print (I bought a copy through
BOS supplies a few years ago). I don't have the details (isbn etc.), I'll
try to post this information tomorrow.

Richard K.





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 11:58:22 -0300
From: ACPQUINN@myriad.middlebury.edu
Subject: RE: ant on a turntable

Yes, this was probably from a physics text... as a matter of fact, I remember
it from a couple years ago in physics :)  The point of the situation was that
the farther out from the center the ant crawls, the faster he is traveling,
since he is traveling further in the same amount of time.  Thus any point on
a line out from the center of the turntable is traveling at a different speed
from all the other points.

They all make the same revolutions per minute though.

Alasdair
acpquinn@myriad.middlebury.edu





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 12:21:22 -0300
From: Joseph Wu <jwu@cs.ubc.ca>
Subject: Re: Patricia Crawford

On Tue, 25 Jul 1995, Richard Kennedy wrote:

> Joseph Wu mentioned sources for diagrams of Patricia Crawford's creations.
> Almost half of Robert Harbin's book "Origami a Step-by-Step Guide" is
> given over to her work. The Harbin book is sadly out of print, but I
> believe that a version in Dutch is still in print (I bought a copy through
> BOS supplies a few years ago). I don't have the details (isbn etc.), I'll
> try to post this information tomorrow.

Oops! I said Kenneway, but I meant Harbin...

Joseph Wu      <jwu@cs.ubc.ca> | Witty quote is now back to the
Master's Student               |   drawing board due to squeamish
University of British Columbia |   readers. Any suggestions?
WWW: http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/jwu/origami.html (Origami Page)





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 12:22:30 -0300
From: Tim Rueger <rueger@areaplg2.corp.mot.com>
Subject: Lang's Insects book - have access to extra copy

Hi, All,

A few weeks ago, I had reserved a copy of Robert Lang's new "Origami
Insects and Their Kin" book at a local bookstore.

Last week, being impatient, I bought a copy I found on the shelf at
another bookstore.  (The book is awesome.  I've been folding bugs like
mad since then.  But that's a story for another message.)

Now, the reserved copy is in, and they're holding it for me.

Does anyone out there without ready access to the book want this extra
copy?  I can pick it up and ship it to you, if you send me a check for
the cost of the book and shipping.

-Tim

--
Tim Rueger             Motorola CCRL IC Design Laboratory, IL02-2921
Fax  : (708) 538-4593  Internet: rueger@areaplg2.corp.mot.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 13:12:56 -0300
From: vann@tredgar.cardiff.com (VAnn Cornelius)
Subject: re: paper longevity

>      With what can I paint/spray my folded boxes as to make them
> leathery/"vinyl-esque"? Everything I have tried makes them sticky and
> unusable. (Decoupage, MogdePodge, DecoGlaze, JoliGlaze).
>

I've had good luck by treating the paper before I fold it and then spraying the
     finished form with an acrylic 'lacquer'.

This works well with simple 4 unit Fuse boxes.  For the octogal boxes I only
     prepare the suface
that will show so that tha paper is not too thick and then spray.

I am however really only attempting to reduce finger print deteriation, They
     are still very much a paper box.

V'Ann





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 13:44:33 -0300
From: Richard Kennedy <KENNEDRA@ibm3090.bham.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Kawahata's NEW dinosaur book

I saw a copy of this book that Rick Beech has obtained. Despite a careful
examination of covers, inside covers etc, we were all unable to find an
isbn. The models are just as Robert describes. You'll die wanting the
book, or die folding the models. (Is this the real meaning of an origami
dinosaur?).

Richard K.





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.CA>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 13:48:37 -0300
From: Valerie Vann <75070.304@compuserve.COM>
Subject: Rose Crystal. Query ASCII diagram

About the ASCII diagram:

I labeled this as a "Send as Shown" rather than reforamattable, but
for it to look right you will have to either print it as PLAIN ASCII TEXT with
a fixed pitch font (like regular typewriter Courier) or display it with
a fixed pitch font (same-same.) as the spacing is critical. Proportionally
spaced fonts such as word processors use (Times-Roman, etc. will make
it unintellible.

If you have a plain text editor like the DOS editor or a program editor that
knows about "columns" (as in 80 characters/columns per line), use that.

--valerie





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 13:49:36 -0300
From: Valerie Vann <75070.304@compuserve.com>
Subject: Bounced mail from somebody's server DG.COM

Recently the mail server of somebody on the list has been rejecting or
bouncing mail from the origami list server. When that happens, the
rejection notice and the original message get bounced all the way back
to whoever sent it, even though the message gets to the list OK.
I thought it might be compuserve again, but all the bounced stuff is from the
same address:

MAILER-DAEMON@RTP41.ceo.dg.com

Can whoever on the list is at this address ask their network guru to
check on this and find out what's happening? Or is this not a valid
address anymore?

Thanx,
--valerie
Compuserve: Valerie Vann 75070,304
Internet: 75070.304@compuserve.com
Internet: valerivann@aol.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 14:03:55 -0300
From: Valerie Vann <75070.304@compuserve.com>
Subject: Jackson Encyclopedia Info

The "Jackson Encyclopedia" mentioned in all the discussions of
the Kawasaki Rose Crystallization/3D Tessellation is:

The Encyclopedia of Origami & Papercraft Techniques
Paul Jackson
Running Press Philadelpia  1991
ISBN 1-56138-063-6
Hardbound, about $25

This was one of a series in similar format about a variety of
crafts. I've seen it in the last year in bookstores, but it may be
out of print now, as I think it was also on the Origami Source's
(FOCA/OUSA's supply store) list of close-outs about 2-3
OUSA newsletters ago.

It is the sort of series that the larger libraries could be expected to
pick up on though. I'd try one of those; especially a university
library if there's an art or decorative arts department.

I almost always get an inspiration just browsing through this book!

Only part of the book is about origami and there aren't many diagrams,
but its one of my favorite books anyway, beautilful photos and covering
all sorts of related paper arts (Jackson is into more than origami...)
including pop-ups, paper sculpture, etc. from a serious fine arts
perspective. The paper arts are taken very seriously at British design
schools, just like embroidery and most of the textile arts. There are some
incredible student "thesis" projects in here, including a paper sculptured
lobster that would probably get propositioned by a real lobster of the
opposite gender ;-)

--valerie
Compuserve: Valerie Vann 75070,304
Internet: 75070.304@compuserve.com
Internet: valerivann@aol.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 14:04:19 -0300
From: A004773%LBVM1.profs@lbgwy.mdc.com
Subject: NO SUBJECT

 I too had to re-subscribe recently.  I suspect something more than
 non-delivery problems may have occurred.

 John Andrisan
 IBMMAIL: USMCDQND   Internet: a004773%lbvm1.profs@mdcgwy.mdc.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 14:26:15 -0300
From: Origamiist@aol.com
Subject: Paper for big Enterprise

Really big. I think the paper was at least 24" square. 10" Foil paper is
recommended but I haven't tried anything else yet.
-Vern





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 14:31:43 -0300
From: Tim Rueger <rueger@areaplg2.corp.mot.com>
Subject: home found (was: Lang's Insects book - have access to extra copy)

Hi, All,

>>>>> "tr" == Tim Rueger <rueger@areaplg2.corp.mot.com> writes:

[stuff about having an extra copy of "Origami Insects..." deleted]

    tr> Does anyone out there without ready access to the book want this extra
    tr> copy?  I can pick it up and ship it to you, if you send me a check for
    tr> the cost of the book and shipping.

I've got a taker for the book.

-Tim





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 14:53:58 -0300
From: jdharris@lust.isem.smu.edu (Jerry D. Harris)
Subject: Re:  Paper for the cuckoo clock

>I've only tried the Cuckoo Clock once and gave up because the paper I was
>using was too brittle (I found a really old roll of teletype paper - it was WAY
>to brittle). I was wondering if anyone has used Fadeless Art Paper. I found a
>school/carnival supply house (don't ask me why they are lumped together) and
>they sell it on rolls that are about 2' wide and maybe 12- 15 feet long. I
>haven't had the time to devote to the project though, so I don't know if it
>will hold up to the strain!

        For the model of the clock I've got on my wall, I used a piece of
pseudo-tissue foil that measured 18" x 126".  How'd I get that?  A roll of
heavy duty aluminum foil, as it turns out, measures 18" wide, and is quite
long (I forget how long, exactly).  I spray-mounted white rice paper on one
side -- I had to use several sheets, carefully lined up on the foil so as
paper on the other (same as the rice paper:  several pieces).  I folded the
clock so that the white ended up on the clock face and the marbled paper
made the house.  It's very nice, somewhat sturdy (heavy duty rice paper),
and about the size of a good-sized real clock!  It's fooled a few people...

Jerry D. Harris
Schuler Museum of Paleontology
Southern Methodist University
jdharris@lust.isem.smu.edu
        (Compuserve:  73132,3372)

---------/O\------*     --->|:|:|>     w___/^^^\--o

Humorous Quote Is Forthcoming...

---------/O\------*     --->|:|:|>     w___/^^^\--o





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 14:56:36 -0300
From: jdharris@lust.isem.smu.edu (Jerry D. Harris)
Subject: Re: Vocation

> I have never done any wetfolding in my life and, quite frankly, I don't
>know that I really want to start right now!  :-D  What kind of paper do you
>use for that - everyone just says use some with sizing - well, I hate looking
>ignorant (most of the time) and so I always say "Oh that's a good idea..."

        What the hey is "sizing?"  I rarely wet fold; on the few occasions
when I've actually tried, I've used simple construction paper (it's spongy
and absorbs water well, without making the paper fall apart or inks run).
I still prefer tissue foil, although I'd love to get the "bulk" that wet
folding can provide -- some models, if done with tissue foil, are still too
limp and flimsy, and don't take any abuse.

        Anyway, the model took over a week to finish -- just the first 3
steps took several days, thanks to the dimensions of the paper (imagine
trying to fold a rectangle longer than most rooms in fourths lengthwise!),
but after all the preliminary folds were in place, the rest of it only took
2-3 days (not working constantly, by any means!)

Jerry D. Harris
Schuler Museum of Paleontology
Southern Methodist University
jdharris@lust.isem.smu.edu
        (Compuserve:  73132,3372)

---------/O\------*     --->|:|:|>     w___/^^^\--o

Humorous Quote Is Forthcoming...

---------/O\------*     --->|:|:|>     w___/^^^\--o





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 15:28:48 -0300
From: tony@ele.puc-rio.br (Antonio Jose' Correia Sampaio)
Subject: Re:  Star Trek Enterprise model?

HI all

        I am a TREKKIE from Brazil and I would love the folding diagrams for
     any of the NCC-1701. It can be TOS, TNG or movie version, any version will
     please me.

        Then I will be able to say "... that I will boldly fold where no man
     has folded before." 8-)

Tony

______________________________________

tony@ele.puc-rio.br





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 15:40:27 -0300
From: Grace.Chiu@Cognos.COM (Chiu, Grace)
Subject: RE: Rose Crystal. Query ASCII diagram

Thanks for the ASCII diagram, Valerie.  I hope it didn't take tooo long.
 I'm now
trying to construct a box to hold it together.  The rosettes along the edges
keep
springing out.

For those of you with Microsoft Mail, select "Change Font" under the View
menu,
and the font will change to Courier for easier reading.  I do this all the
time to
read the odd .signature.

Grace
 ---
Grace Chiu, Enslavened Manager, Technology Support Services,
Cognos Inc.: Rubberneckers on the Information Super-Dirt Road
Ottawa, ON 1-800-365-3968, ext. 3218.
Grace.Chiu@Cognos.COM or chiug@cognos.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 15:44:35 -0300
From: Jae Hyuk Lee <jaelee@WPI.EDU>
Subject: Origami-l FAQs (Re: recommend.....)

> I am new to the list so please pardon me, but where can the FAQ be located?

Welcome to the list!  Here are some sites to start you off.

Origami links by Bob Shuster
http://www.netaxs.com/people/rshuster/hotlist.html#origami

Origami links by Joseph Wu
http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/jwu/home-other.html

Origami-l archive + FAQs
ftp://rugcis.rug.nl/origami/   -->  same as:  ftp rugcis.rug.nl
                                              cd origami

--
   |\_                                                  ___.-.___  ________
   | =\_.     o            jaelee@wpi.edu     M  _  o   \_______/ (|______/
  /______)   <M\     \o      Jae H. Lee       a (_|_/}     `-'_\\___||_  BDFT
 //O"O"O"O   / > o _^/>  Worcester Polytech.  c ]"[ <T       )[______.-'  #42





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 16:37:28 -0300
From: GURKEWITZ@WCSUB.CTSTATEU.EDU
Subject: RE: ant on a turntable

There is another problem involving walking bugs of some sort.
It results in a 'pursuit curve' and goes like this. Say you start with
a square with one ant on each corner facing the ant on the next corner
in a clockwise direction. Then, all four ant start walking toward the
ant they're looking at. The catch is that the ant they're looking at
is moving and so instead of the ants walking along the outer edge
of the square they walk along a path that spirals towards the center
of the square.

Rona





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 16:44:40 -0300
From: "Londono, Juancarlos (3421)" <J.LONDONO@CGNET.COM>
Subject: Re: Colombian Origami Asociation

* From: origami-l
* To: Multiple recipients of list
* Subject: Re: VOCATION
* Date: Tuesday, July 25, 1995 11:18AM

* Greetings, One of our memebers from FOLD (Florida Origami Learners and
* Devotees) is going to be in Colombia. He isn't able to have access to the
* net, yet and he asked me to ask if I could find any origami connections or

* contacts for him. Can you help? Many thanks, Beck

*************************************************
Hi.

Here in Cali, Colombia there is a Origami Asociation called Asociacion
Vallecaucana de Origami
(Valley of Cauca Origami Asociation)
it belongs to Asociacion Colombo Japonesa (Colombo-japanese Asociation)
The address is:       Calle 13N #6-40
TELEFAX:                (92)6610930

*but I'm not connected to them*

(I hope your friend speak spanish)

Please give me phone number in Cali to the FOLD member who will visit my
country, if I can help him, please let me know
Juancarlos

Office Phone number 4450264
j.londono@cgnet.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 17:44:10 -0300
From: A004773%LBVM1.profs@lbgwy.mdc.com
Subject: NO SUBJECT

 Rona, what is the total distance travelled by each ant from the corner
 of the square to the center where they meet?

 I think it's equal to the side of the square, but I am only guessing.

 John Andrisan
 IBMMAIL: USMCDQND   Internet: a004773%lbvm1.profs@mdcgwy.mdc.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 18:30:20 -0300
From: Eric Tend <eric@hpisdaja.ptp.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Paper for big Enterprise

Vern wrote:
> 10" Foil paper is recommended but I haven't tried anything else yet.

I've folded it from 10" foil and the resultant model turns out to be about
5.5" in length.  It _really_ does look like the original Enterprise ...
proportional layout, warp engines, impulse engine, bridge on the saucer
section!  I'm going to have to try it again soon ... since the first time
was done without diagrams ... just Jeremy's verbal and visual instruction
at a BARF meeting.

--Eric--

==============================================================================
     ____/__/__/__/__/__/__/ | "Its all in the reflexes"
      __/         __/        |                       -- Jack Burton
_______/__/      __/         |================================================
    __/         __/          | Eric Tend
 ____/__/__/   __/           | eric@hpisdaja.ptp.hp.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 19:11:38 -0300
From: "BOB T. LYNCH" <blynch@du.edu>
Subject: Enterprise

Hi all -

I received a copy of Jeremy's Enterprise from a friend that was able to attend
the convention. I tried it with some tissue foil - it works great! I think
the next time I do it though, I will try to cut down the thickness by laminating
only one side of the foil rather than both. I found some gold metallic tissue
paper which looks very classy! I haven't been able to find silver though! I
would think it should be out there somewhere!

The first model I did was with and 8 1/2 inch square and the resulting ship
came out to be around three to four inches long (I gave it away before I could
measure it) Oddly enough, it looked better in some ways than the next one I
made. I made the second with about a 13 inch square. I think it is too floppy
or something... just doesn't hold it's shape. I am going to attempt it with
some "regular" foil paper, but the largest I have is 6 inches (eeps!)

It is a fun model, and I would encourage all you other Trekkers out there to
write to Jeremy and get the diagrams!!

Dee

PS Any of you interested in the details about our upcoming September Star Trek
convention here in Denver? E-mail me personally, and I'll get back to you!!





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 19:40:16 -0300
From: Jack.Thomas.Weres@att.com
Subject: Dollar Bill: Washington Mushroom Head in Frame

to my fellow happy folders of paper,,,

last night
          as my wife convinced me to make 100 dollar-bill rings
          for a money tree which has cut-out hands on it
          which will be at my sister-in-law's wedding shower a month from now...

i was checking out my dollar bill origami book
(forgot the name -- it's at home)
to familiarize myself with the model

my wife then informed me that
SHE knew of an origami model involving a dollar bill

she proceeded to fold the dollar bill horizontally twice
so that Washington's head and neck combined
to look like an atomic mushroom cloud

i gave her some static
                      about HOW POWERFUL this model was

she said that she did remember
that someone was able to create the Washington mushroom head/cloud
within a "frame"

THE ORIGAMI QUESTION FOR THE DAY:

        does anyone out there know of this
        "Washington Mushroom Head/Cloud in a Frame" dollar bill model???

        if so
        then could you please send the a copy of diagrams to me???

thanks so much

---

c         _     m                      MAKE THINGS HAPPEN
 o        \\     i
  l      ((\\     c
   o      (\___    r        -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    s      ||       o         -=-=-=-=-=-                        -=-=-=-=-=-
     s  ========     s          -=-=-=-=-    jack thomas weres   -=-=-=-=-
      a               c           -=-=-=-                        -=-=-=-
       l               o            -=-=- jtweres@psp.ih.att.com -=-=-
                        p             -=-                        -=-
                         e              -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 20:33:00 -0300
From: "Londono, Juancarlos (3421)" <J.LONDONO@CGNET.COM>
Subject: Internet Origami Home page

I wondering who has a complete list of the Origami Home Pages on the NET

I'll really appreciate this information

J.londono@cgnet.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 21:20:49 -0300
From: Joseph Wu <jwu@cs.ubc.ca>
Subject: Re: Internet Origami Home page

On Tue, 25 Jul 1995, Londono, Juancarlos (3421) wrote:

> I wondering who has a complete list of the Origami Home Pages on the NET
>
> I'll really appreciate this information

Mine is probably as complete as they get. Try

  http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/jwu/home-other.html

Joseph Wu      <jwu@cs.ubc.ca> | Witty quote is now back to the
Master's Student               |   drawing board due to squeamish
University of British Columbia |   readers. Any suggestions?
WWW: http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/jwu/origami.html (Origami Page)





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 22:43:06 -0300
From: Hans Gerwitz <gerwitz@sluaxa.slu.edu>
Subject: Delurking... rec.arts.origami?

As a non-serious folder (so far) who only folds cranes out of boredom and
peacocks for tips, I've kept quiet on this list... however, my mailbox is
becomming overwhelmed with the traffic (I'm on several professional
lists, but they all tend to average 1-2 msgs/day)

I had to leave the INTP (personality type) list to save my box, but would
rather not unsubscribe here; I want to continue learning through
osmosis... which leads to the obvious question...

Why isn't there a rec.arts.origami?  I think this list alone generates
enough traffic to merit a newsgroup, and the added visibility would
certainly increase participation. Besides, it would go well next to
rec.arts.bonsai :-)

Is anyone on the list familier with the procedures and net.politics
involved with newsgroup creation?  If no one is, I will try to set aside
a bit of free time and go through it, if someone else is willing to take
votes (I'm a bit overwhelmed at work, and need to prepare for fall
semester, or I would do it all).

Hans Gerwitz
SLU C&IS
gerwitz@sluaxa.slu.edu





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 23:33:21 -0300
From: Modice@aol.com
Subject: Re: re: paper longevity

> I've had good luck by treating the paper before I fold it and     then
spraying the finished form with an acrylic 'lacquer'.

What kind of lacquer? Brand name? Exactly what is on the label? (I know - I
sound anal - but I'd like to know EXACTLY what to get and EXACTLY what has
worked for others.

Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 23:59:07 -0300
From: Jae Hyuk Lee <jaelee@WPI.EDU>
Subject: Re: Delurking... rec.arts.origami?

> Why isn't there a rec.arts.origami?  I think this list alone generates
> enough traffic to merit a newsgroup, and the added visibility would
> certainly increase participation. Besides, it would go well next to
> rec.arts.bonsai :-)

In terms of hierarchy, rec.crafts.origami is probably better.

I'm kind of weary of newsgroups because the quality tends to deteriorate
pretty fast.  Mailing lists, OTOH, tend to maintain high quality posts.





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 00:19:23 -0300
From: Joseph Wu <jwu@cs.ubc.ca>
Subject: Re: Delurking... rec.arts.origami?

On Tue, 25 Jul 1995, Jae Hyuk Lee wrote:

> In terms of hierarchy, rec.crafts.origami is probably better.

Why? I don't know about you, but my origami is ART, not craft.

> I'm kind of weary of newsgroups because the quality tends to deteriorate
> pretty fast.  Mailing lists, OTOH, tend to maintain high quality posts.

I must agree with you there...

Joseph Wu      <jwu@cs.ubc.ca> | Witty quote is now back to the
Master's Student               |   drawing board due to squeamish
University of British Columbia |   readers. Any suggestions?
WWW: http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/jwu/origami.html (Origami Page)





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 02:56:56 -0300
From: Douglas Zander <dzander@solaria.sol.net>
Subject: No newsgroup please.

  Hi all,

    You know what you're going to get with a newsgroup, don't you?

  *****FOR SALE*****  BUY MY PRODUCT BUY MY PRODUCT BUY MY PRODUCT!!!

  THIS IS NOT A SPAM!  SEND 10 COPIES OF THE FOLLOWING LETTER TO EVERYONE
  YOU KNOW!!!  (DON'T FORGET TO INCLUDE A DOLLAR)

  IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE SITUATION IN ________ THEN SIGN THIS PETITION AND
  SEND IT EVERYWHERE YOU CAN.  UPLOAD IT TO EVERY NEWSGROUP AND MAILING LIST
  THAT YOU HAVE ACCESS TO!!!

  REPENT SINNERS THE END OF THE WORLD IS COMMING!!!  REPENT NOW!!!

  I don't think we need this stuff in rec.crafts.origami or rec.arts.origami
  I don't think we need a newsgroup for origami.  Period.

--
 Douglas Zander          | editor of GAMES Player's Zine (GPZ)
 dzander@solaria.sol.net | an ezine for subscribers of GAMES Magazine (tm)





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 07:04:31 -0300
From: Richard Kennedy <KENNEDRA@ibm3090.bham.ac.uk>
Subject: Patricia Crawford

The Dutch version of Robert Harbin's "Origami, A Step by Step Guide" is:

   "Origami  Japanse Papiervouwkunst"
   isbn  90 252 6270 8

Apart from the translation of all the text into Dutch, the books appear
to be identical. I bought a copy from BOS supplies for 5 pounds (about
8 US dollars) a few years ago. I can enquire if the book is still available,
if anyone is interested.

I think that there are some models by Ligia Montoya and Patricia Crawford
in the Harbin series "Origami 1, 2, 3 and 4".

Richard K.





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 09:31:58 -0300
From: logician!sophie!pat@uunet.uu.net (Pat Zura)
Subject: Re: Paper size for Enterprise model

In Regards to your letter <199507250249.WAA05002@bigwpi.WPI.EDU>:

>I know it'll be a while before I can request the BARF back issue, but
>could you tell us what size/shape paper you used to get a foot-long model?

A 10 inch square will make an approx. 4 inch model.





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.CA>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 10:04:36 -0300
From: Rjlang@aol.COM
Subject: Re: Ligia Montoya

> For those who don't know, Ligia Montoya is no longer with us. I believe
> that her mentor was Cerceda, but I'm not certain. Ligia was from South
> America (Argentina, I believe), and was one of the finest paperfolders from
> the Spanish/Moorish tradition, along with Cerceda and Unamuno (sp?). Her
> works can be found in some of Randlett's books, as well as in Ansill's
> _Lifestyle_Origami_ (AKA _Practical_Origami_).

Actually, her mentor was Dr. Vicente Solorzano-Sagredo. He was an origami
designer and he hired Montoya as a drafter to draw diagrams of his models.
She subsequently designed her own models, drew up and distributed them.
Here's where things get murky. According to him, she passed off his models as
her own. According to her, everything she passed off as her own WAS her own.
Needless to say, there was much bad blood, some of which found its way into
the letters section of the Origamian.

Now for my opinion: having seen published work by both several years ago,
there is a _definite_ difference in styles between the two folders. Thus, I
don't believe the claims that she passed off his stuff as her own. On the
other hand, she used bases that he used too -- but then, in the mid-1960's,
practically EVERYONE was using the same bases (Bird, Frog, and combinations
thereof) and techniques. Was she influenced by him? Sure. Did she steal his
designs? I don't think so.

Although this conflict and the big Cerceda-Yoshizawa flap (sorry) were big
deals back in the 60's, it's been a long time since anyone raised a ruckus
about someone stealing their designs (although, thanks to Ayture-Scheele,
Kneissler, et al., out-and-out plagiarism from books is still with us).
Although there is still a lot of simultaneous invention going on, origami
designers nowadays seem to recognize coincidence when it happens and don't
get all worked up about it -- one of the things that's nice about this field
of endeavor.

Robert





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.CA>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 10:20:51 -0300
From: Rjlang@aol.COM
Subject: more TREK, segue to Bloom County

> I hope Jeremy doesn't mind if I use variations of his
> "enterprise Base" to do this. Who Knows maybe we could sell it to
Paramount!

More likely, they'll threaten to sue you big-time. Corporate owners of
trademarked figures (particularly those that bring in big licensing revenues)
tend to be trigger-happy with the ol' lawyer.

(A notable exception, BTW, is Berke Breathed; a few years ago I sent an
origami Opus to the FOCA convention, and his syndicate not only allowed FOCA
to publish it in the convention program, they offered to let FOCA publish one
Bloom County strip, all for free!)

Robert

P.S. Speaking of such, has anyone ever seen a good origami Bill the Cat?





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 11:25:51 -0300
From: Tim Rueger <rueger@areaplg2.corp.mot.com>
Subject: Re: Delurking... rec.arts.origami?

Hi, all,

>>>>> "jw" == Joseph Wu <jwu@cs.ubc.ca> writes:

    jw> On Tue, 25 Jul 1995, Jae Hyuk Lee wrote:
    >> In terms of hierarchy, rec.crafts.origami is probably better.

    jw> Why? I don't know about you, but my origami is ART, not craft.

About a year or so ago, Brian Ewins was working on a proposal for an
origami USENET newsgroup, but the effort lapsed.  He may have lost net
access.

In terms of hierarchy naming, you could do any of the following, since
origami can cover such a wide range of disciplines:

    rec.crafts.paper.origami    <--- I think these were the ones Brian
    rec.crafts.paper.misc       <--- was working on

    rec.crafts.origami          It's a craft!
    rec.arts.origami            No, it's an art!
    sci.math.origami            No, it's geometry!

    etc.

Since I think everyone would agree that origami is a *recreation*, I'd
push for just:

    rec.origami

I think it would work just fine; there'd be no need to decide whether
origami is an art, science, craft, or whatever.  Here's a list of
"one-leaf" rec.* hierarchy names currently on my newsserver:

    rec.answers         rec.hunting             rec.s
    rec.aquaria         rec.juggling            rec.scouting
    rec.backcountry     rec.kites               rec.scuba
    rec.birds           rec.martial-arts        rec.skate
    rec.climbing        rec.misc                rec.skating
    rec.equestrian      rec.nude                rec.skydiving
    rec.folk-dancing    rec.pyrotechnics        rec.windsurfing
    rec.golf            rec.railroad            rec.woodworking
    rec.guns            rec.roller-coaster
    rec.heraldry        rec.running

    >> I'm kind of weary of newsgroups because the quality tends to deteriorate
    >> pretty fast.  Mailing lists, OTOH, tend to maintain high quality posts.

    jw> I must agree with you there...

Me, too, unfortunately.  There are exceptions; my favorite,
rec.toys.lego, has very high signal-to-noise ratio.

We could always set up the newsgroup with a moderator; finding
volunteers over the years may be difficult, however.

-Tim
--
Tim Rueger             Motorola CCRL IC Design Laboratory, IL02-2921
Fax  : (708) 538-4593  Internet: rueger@areaplg2.corp.mot.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 11:38:43 -0300
From: Grace.Chiu@Cognos.COM (Chiu, Grace)
Subject: RE: ...Bloom County

Robert wrote:
>(A notable exception, BTW, is Berke Breathed; a few years ago I sent an
>origami Opus to the FOCA convention, and his syndicate not only allowed
FOCA
>to publish it in the convention program, they offered to let FOCA publish
one
>Bloom County strip, all for free!)

Oh, this is SO COOL!

I was just thinking of them this morning!  I'm a MAjor Bloom County fan.
 One of my
several Opus dolls fell off the shelf and onto my origami pile-o-stuff at
home.
Can I possibly get a copy of the instructions for folding the beloved Opus?
 I'll send
you lots of Canadian Tire money (see posts from 2 wks ago).

>P.S. Speaking of such, has anyone ever seen a good origami Bill the Cat?

I have a Bill the Cat doll hanging from a washroom door at home too.  I
attempted
to fold on once (got a pile of neon orange paper) kinda modularly -- he's so
tubular, y'know.  Then how to you do his feet and attach them?  It's hard to
do his eyes
because his head is so asymetical too.  A worthy challenge!!

GRACiously,
 ---
Grace Chiu, Enslavened Manager, Technology Support Services,
Cognos Inc.: Rubberneckers on the Information Super-Dirt Road
Ottawa, ON 1-800-365-3968, ext. 3218.
Grace.Chiu@Cognos.COM or chiug@cognos.com





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 11:46:03 -0300
From: ACPQUINN@myriad.middlebury.edu
Subject: Newsgroup stuff.

Hallo all-
I'm not sure whether I speak for anyone other than myself on this, but the VAX
that handles email and such things at my site does not have a newsgroup reader.
I have been told for a couple of years now that one will be purchased "soon"
but I am not optimistic.  In any case, the person who pointed out that a
newsgroup, either in rec.arts or rec.crafts, would subject the list to excess
amounts of spam was entirely correct: in this case, perhaps expanded visibility
would not be such a good idea.  I do not wish to sound elitist, but the
presence of spam and spammers necessitates this frame of mind.
In any case, this discussion already took place some time ago, and a vote was
taken on whether to create a newsgroup.  Since no newsgroup yet exists, I would
infer that the vote fell through.  However, those who wish to see the messages
pertaining to this vote and the newsgroup debate would be well advised to FTP
80-some archives is relevant)
my $.02 anyway,
-Alasdair
acpquinn@myriad.middlebury.edu





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 11:53:37 -0300
From: Joseph Wu <jwu@cs.ubc.ca>
Subject: Re: more TREK, segue to Bloom County

On Wed, 26 Jul 1995 Rjlang@aol.com wrote:

> (A notable exception, BTW, is Berke Breathed; a few years ago I sent an
> origami Opus to the FOCA convention, and his syndicate not only allowed FOCA
> to publish it in the convention program, they offered to let FOCA publish one
> Bloom County strip, all for free!)
>
> P.S. Speaking of such, has anyone ever seen a good origami Bill the Cat?

Funny you should mention that...I've got a generic cartoon cat head model
from many years ago that I think could be easily modified to become Bill
the Cat's head. Hmmm...time to dig it out and explore the possibilities!

Joseph Wu      <jwu@cs.ubc.ca> | Witty quote is now back to the
Master's Student               |   drawing board due to squeamish
University of British Columbia |   readers. Any suggestions?
WWW: http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/jwu/origami.html (Origami Page)





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 12:15:18 -0300
From: Jennifer.Campbell@cciw.ca (Jennifer Campbell)
Subject: USENET newsgroup issue

I see the origami-l becoming a Usenet newsgroup issue has raised its ugly
head again (I read through the archives to catch the first round).

I'm against it for a personal reason that I bet affects lots of our members:
I get my Internet access at work. Unless the newsgroup was snuck in under a
code name in the science or computer hierarchy, I'd never see it again. And
if I go to special measures to thwart that restriction, would I see a
degenerated "origami-l" full of spams, noise and "what's origami? please
send me everything you know" questions?

But that aside, what would be the benefit? It seems that people are
mentioning more "cons" than "pros" (just curious). And if in response to
concerns about usenet access, the mailing list was somehow cross-posted
(creating a redundancy--I think that idea was floated before) what would be
the point?

       /\_/\       ________
     `(     )' oo /        \
       `==='     | Maguro o |
       /   \     |  kudasai |
      |     |     \________/
      |     |
    ___\___/__jennifer.campbell@cciw.ca





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 12:37:05 -0300
From: Steve Arlow <yorick@conch.aa.msen.com>
Subject: Re: No newsgroup please.

>    You know what you're going to get with a newsgroup, don't you?
>
>  *****FOR SALE*****  BUY MY PRODUCT BUY MY PRODUCT BUY MY PRODUCT!!!
>
>  THIS IS NOT A SPAM!  SEND 10 COPIES OF THE FOLLOWING LETTER TO EVERYONE

Thank you for sharing.

Don't do it again.

--
 "...the paws of fear upon your chest,  |  Steve Arlow, Yorick Software Inc.
  only love can soothe that beast..."   |  39336 Polo Club Dr. #103,
               -- Indigo Girls          |  Farmington Hills, MI  48335-5634
   (.sig quote contest has been won)    |  http://www.msen.com/~yorick





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 12:47:07 -0300
From: Jae Hyuk Lee <jaelee@WPI.EDU>
Subject: Origami as art (was rec.arts.origami)

> Why? I don't know about you, but my origami is ART, not craft.

OK.  Far be it from me to argue with an artist.  :)

It doesn't really matter to me which name is used if a newsgroup were to be
set up.  It's just that the rec.arts.* hierarchy is very broadly set up (e.g.
r.a.startrek.*, r.a.tv, etc) whereas rec.crafts.* hierarchy arguably has
similar topics already set up (e.g. r.c.textile, r.c.jewelry, etc).

Even in bookstores, origami books are shelved among the crafts' books, not
the art books.  I tried to verify the classification at the U.S. Library of
Congress WWW page (http://lcweb.loc.gov/homepage/lchp.html), but I didn't
have much time to play with their computer interface.  Of course, if
origami-l members feel very strongly about differentiating origami from
craft, then rec.arts.origami would be better.

I think people differentiate between art as a classification and art as....
a philosophy -- for lack of a better term.  For example, medicine is
classified as a science but many physicians consider its practice as an art.
I noticed a pediatrician among the list of vocations;  perhaps he/she could

For some, origami is merely a fun craft/art, but for others, it's an art (by
my second definition) and their life.  I have a feeling that I opened a
floodgate with this.  Let me have it folks!  Rip my thoughts into tiny
little shreds of paper...errr  electrons!

--
   |\_                                                  ___.-.___  ________
   | =\_.     o            jaelee@wpi.edu     M  _  o   \_______/ (|______/
  /______)   <M\     \o      Jae H. Lee       a (_|_/}     `-'_\\___||_  BDFT
 //O"O"O"O   / > o _^/>  Worcester Polytech.  c ]"[ <T       )[______.-'  #42





Return-path: <origami-l@nstn.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 12:50:44 -0300
From: Jeannine Mosely <j9@concentra.com>
Subject: Re: No newsgroup please.

Three comments about an origami newsgroup:

Around a year ago, someone was investigating starting one.  A friend
saw an announcement regarding this and forwarded it to me.  That's how
I learned about this list.  Thanks to everyone involved!  Maybe if we
try again, it will fail again, but more people will learn about us ;-).

My net access is through my job.  My employers limit our news feed to
work relevant groups.  I would not be able to receive an origami
newsgroup.  Is anyone else in a similar situation?  (I guess I could
pay cash for a commercial service.)

I have been on this list for over a year and I have yet to see a flame
war.  Do you know of newsgroup that can make this claim?

        -- jeannine
