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From: mkinyon@peabody.iusb.indiana.edu (Michael Kinyon)
Subject: Re: Legend's lessons for IF
Message-ID: <D6KvM6.2AE@sun2.iusb.indiana.edu>
Keywords: Legend Lives, JC, existentialism, deconstructionism, life itself...
Sender: mkinyon@peabody.iusb.indiana.edu (Michael Kinyon)
Nntp-Posting-Host: peabody.iusb.indiana.edu
Organization: Indiana Unixversity South Bend
References: <95085.041835MBS110@psuvm.psu.edu> <3l752n$e6a@life.ai.mit.edu> <3l7uhr$ee9@wanda.pond.com>
Date: Wed, 5 Apr 1995 20:01:18 GMT
Lines: 81

In article <3l7uhr$ee9@wanda.pond.com>,
Matthew Russotto <russotto@wanda.pond.com> wrote:
>In article <3l752n$e6a@life.ai.mit.edu>, David Baggett <dmb@ai.mit.edu> wrote:

[Dave:]
>}One problem that (I believe) Mike Kinyon had with Legend when he tested it
>}last year, and that other people commented on recently, was that he felt
>}that he played only a tiny role in the outcome --- that his actions were
>}largely irrelevant.

Yes, it was I, but it wasn't exactly being a little fish in a big pond that
bothered me.  IF is filled with adventurers saving the universe by 
blundering around.

[Dave:]
>} I can see why this might be disturbing, but it really
>}couldn't have been any other way.  The story is not about you, ultimately.
>}You're just a witness; the real protagonist is JC.  You're at best an
>}accidental hero.  Your individual role must be tiny in such a gigantic
>}conflict.

I don't really have a problem with this; the statement I have a problem
with is who the "real" protagonist is.

[Matt:]
>I think that's the biggest flaw in the game.  I took a lot of actions
>which basically seemed completely disconnected with the flow of the
>game, and had no purpose.

I actually wonder whether the purposelessness that pervades L.L. is,
unlike other IF works, deliberate.  Back when I tested the game, it
bothered me, but because of my familiarity with the rest of the Unkuulian
universe, I let it go.  Upon reflection, I have decided that the seeming
randomness is, in fact, a commentary on human existence itself: just
as the flap of a butterfly's wings today affects the weather of the world
in a week, so too do the meaningless acts of insignificant people affect
the lives of everyone on a scale beyond individual comprehension.

There are only three IF authors whom I think would force the player to
perform meaningless actions in order to reinforce the theme, and Dave is
one of them.  It was a gutsy move, considering how many games there are
that force the player to perform a meaningless act because the author thought
it was a nifty puzzle.

[Matt:]
>The game only moved forward in long tracts of text with no player 
>interaction.

Now here I agree, and I consider this to be a separate issue from the
"meaningless acts" point.  There were a couple of times while I was watching
pages of text scroll past that I wondered: what happened to the "I" in IF?

[Dave:]
>}It does disappoint me that people are having trouble sympathizing with JC.

Yes, that was a problem I had back in the testing days.  I did not interact
with him, I did not get to know him, and other than an intellectual 
admiration of his sacrifice, I didn't feel much when he was gone.
I think other people have brought this up, but the obvious comparison here
is with Floyd in Planetfall.  I spend many turns of game time and hours of
real time getting to know Floyd, being annoyed when he wouldn't do what
I wanted, laughing at his ridiculous antics, and so on.  By the time he made 
his (supposed) sacrifice, I knew him pretty well, so I was deeply touched.
I never really knew JC.

[Dave:]
>}The climax is, again, deliberately understated, but I guess I went too far.

Actually, I don't think people are objecting so much to the climax as to
the denouement.  But even then, having it understated would have been fine 
if I had had a chance to become truly intimate with JC and the others.

OK, that was my post to the newsgroup for this year.  (Yes, I realize it
has been a long time.)

Michael
-- 
Michael Kinyon                   |   mkinyon@peabody.iusb.indiana.edu
Dept of Mathematics & Comp. Sci. |                 ...
Indiana University South Bend    |                 /|\
South Bend, IN 46634 USA         |                / | \
