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Subject: Re: Fully customizable x-toolbar.el
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From: Hrvoje Niksic <hniksic@srce.hr>
Date: 09 Apr 1997 13:07:28 +0200
In-Reply-To: Jeff Miller's message of Wed, 9 Apr 1997 00:44:53 -0400
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Jeff Miller <jmiller@bayserve.net> writes:

> First, I gotta ask, did you accidently drink 5 gallons of extra strong
> coffee?  :-) :-)

Nope.  I just decided custom was cool.  The effect was the same. :-)

Seriously, even if one dislikes the customize *interface*, the
thrilling things is that there is now a way to actually define what a
variable is.  Before customize, the only place for such a definition
was the docstring. :-(

If we don't like the interface/find it slow, we can
change/rewrite/push-into-C it.

> pretty cool.  The alist customization  is very close to what I though it
> would look like.  Is there a way to make it not display the compiled
> function stuff and instead something like:
> 
>   Start With: (toolbar-external "xterm" "-e" "trn")

But it does.  Be sure to redump your XEmacs.  Here is what I get in
the customization buffer:

This is a customization buffer.
Push RET or click mouse-2 on the word _help_ for more information.

* Toolbar Mail Commands Alist:
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  vm
            Start with:  vm
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  gnus
            Start with:  gnus-no-server
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  rmail
            Start with:  rmail
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  mh
            Start with:  mh-rmail
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  pine
            Start with:  (toolbar-external "xterm" "-e" "pine")
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  elm
            Start with:  (toolbar-external "xterm" "-e" "elm")
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  mutt
            Start with:  (toolbar-external "xterm" "-e" "mutt")
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  exmh
            Start with:  (toolbar-external "exmh")
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  netscape
            Start with:  (toolbar-external "netscape")
[INS] [DEL] Cons-cell:
            Mailer:  demo-mailer
            Start with:  (toolbar-external "zhmrlj")
[INS]
State: this item is unchanged from its factory setting.
[ ] [?] Alist of mail readers and their commands.

> On the other hand, if I put on my novice-user cap, I think I'd be
> confused by the news & mail reader customization.  validation is
> fine if I know a priori what I want to type in.  If I've stumbled
> onto the mail or news reader alist and know enough about lisp to
> know those are my choices then I'd have a shot.

What do you mean?  <rms> If it is so, it's a documentation bug.
Documentation bugs are as important as program bugs. </rms>

Maybe the docs should make it more clear that the `mail reader' is in
fact an arbitrary symbol used by `toolbar' mail reader to distinguish
between the lot.  For example, one can have a `mail reader'
`vm-no-frame' with a form to fire up a frameless vm.

Anyway, with the #<compiled-function ...> stuff removed, I think the
toolbar customization is quite nice now.

> Ideally, I'd think a user would prefer a customization buffer with a
> bunch of radio buttons and they would just click on their choice.

I don't like overdoing the radio buttons.  The `choice' is more
elegant.  However, I did respect your way of handling it.  You were
first. :-)

> If the radio buttons are generated from the [news/mail]-reader-alist
> then there would not be a need to validate.

Well, yes, but can you do it with customize?  I mean, easily?

-- 
Hrvoje Niksic <hniksic@srce.hr> | Student at FER Zagreb, Croatia
--------------------------------+--------------------------------
"Silence!" cries Freydag. "I did not call thee in for a consultation!" 
"They are my innards! I will not have them misread by a poseur!"

